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LordGigaIce

Another babka?
Citizen
You see, I don't actually think that's the case; we're just innoculated to his bs now.

Like, because I'm an idiot, I'll rewatch those older films from time to time. (I also will rewatch Prime Wars and War for Cybertron, like I said, I'm an idiot) and I really don't think those films have any legs up on RotB 8-20 years later. It's the same noise, it's just old hat at this point.
A lot of RotB, to me, comes off as not particularly interesting. I really liked the direction Bumblebee took things in, and was looking forward to RotB.
What I got wasn't a continuation of the theme and style of Bumblebee, but Bay-lite.

Is it "the same noise"? I don't think so. RotB has ambitions but it decides to stay so close to trying to be a Bay film that it's emotional hooks with Noah and his bro and Elena fall flat.
Bay's movies never had deep character work either, but there's a manic energy that keeps you engaged. RotB didn't have that. Caple wasn't trying for that to be fair, but I don't think you can pare Serious Character Work™️ with Bay's pacing and expect it to land. And to be frank? It doesn't. Noah only works because Anthony Ramos makes the most out of what he's given.

But to my larger point... while RotB and Bay's films have very similar plot structures and issues with Transformers who aren't characters, Bay made up for that with action.
Blackout's assault on the military base. Barricade stalking Sam. The Autobots' arrival to Earth. The Los Angeles Mission City battle. The forest battle. Chicago.
Say what you will about Bay's films overall, these action set pieces are pretty great as set pieces, in part because of how practical effects and stunts were used as much as possible.

Like... the first three Bay movies and RotB all culminate with big battles over McGuffins but the Bay final battles all feel distinct and energetic in their own ways, whereas RotB's takes place in a lifeless grey DBZ wasteland, conjured from the deepest pits of the MCU's computer files.

I'm not saying you have to like Bay's output. Of the five films he did I genuinely only enjoyed two of them ('07 and DotM if we're keeping score) but I do think there's a notable distinction in the manic energy and cinematic spectacle in Bay's offerings and the attempt to mimic it without that touch in RotB.

I was ready to move beyond the Bay movies after TLK crashed and burned and Bumblebee was exactly what I wanted.
Thing is if they weren't going to commit to that direction I'd have rather them just gone back to Bay to Bay it up rather than doing Diet Bay after no one asked for it.

As for this news... I genuinely enjoyed Transformers One but it... did not succeed. Paramount going back to the last guy to make any serious cash with a Transformers movie after that isn't shocking.

I will say that judging from Bay's non-Transformers outings... he can film a pretty great movie if he has a good script to work with, he's just not gonna elevate a bad script.

So I'm reserving any dread or cautious optimism until I hear who's allegedly writing this movie he's allegedly directing.
 

Undead Scottsman

Well-known member
Citizen
That's the noise I'm talking about though.

None of those scenes you mentioned are really that better or worse than what happens in RotB, IMO. I don't see the "energy" you're talking about that's absent from RotB. I feel like we just saw them first and more often, so they stick in the mind more.

On a genuine reappraisal of those scenes, I don't think they stand out any better than, say, the mountainside battle in RoTB. CGI was better, but that's more an issue with modern Hollywood that I doubt Bay will be able to fix.
 

LordGigaIce

Another babka?
Citizen
That's the noise I'm talking about though.

None of those scenes you mentioned are really that better or worse than what happens in RotB, IMO. I don't see the "energy" you're talking about that's absent from RotB. I feel like we just saw them first and more often, so they stick in the mind more.

On a genuine reappraisal of those scenes, I don't think they stand out any better than, say, the mountainside battle in RoTB. CGI was better, but that's more an issue with modern Hollywood that I doubt Bay will be able to fix.
We'll have to agree to disagree on this one, because there's definitely an energy (I don't know how else to describe it) to Bay's Transformers outings that I think RotB just lacks, despite its ambitions.
 

CoffeeHorse

Exhausted, but still standing.
Staff member
Council of Elders
Citizen
It's TV commercial energy. Making TV commercials is absolute production hell. You have 30 seconds to tell your story (to the extent you have a story) and you don't have all day to do retakes because you're not the only crew renting the studio that day. Get in, get out.

That's where Michael Bay got his start, and that's where he lives. When AOE turns into a Bud Light commercial out of nowhere, it's not shameless product placement. It's enthusiastic product placement. Someone left the camera unattended and Bay just couldn't help himself.
 


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