Traitor Watch - The 45 & 47 Thread

Axaday

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Allegedly. I don't remember who it was (I know it wasn't Mark Cuban, but that's the only name my brain is willing to come up with atm), but I heard an actual billionaire make the case that by spending roughly $20 million a year a person can convincingly act like a billionaire, and if there's one thing Trump can do instinctively, it's run a con.
I don't know how much public information there is, generally, to make the determinations. But his stake in Truth Social makes him a billionaire and that is publicly know.
 

wonko the sane?

You may test that assumption at your convinience.
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His stake in truth social (and the associated company, DJT.) makes him a billionaire... on paper. Not in his bank account. By the time he manages to actually sell off his shares, the value will have absolutely cratered, and given how badly the IPO has gone: considering the company he went to for the oversight turned out to be a MASSIVE fraud wherein the owner is functionally barred because of the discrepancies in the paper work, and trump had to find another company, and there is a ridiculous amount of federal oversight going into this because the truth social account is about 30 times bigger than the biggest client in the new firm.

Trump is broke. truth social will be worthless by the time he gets to sell off, IF he even gets to sell off because the securities and exchange commission is apparently taking no ******* prisoners.
 

Axaday

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Even before Truth Social, people who make it their business to know say he was a billionaire. The public can be fooled by spending $20 million a year, maybe, but I don't think Forbes is just watching that.
 

wonko the sane?

You may test that assumption at your convinience.
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Even without truth social, his value was basically only on paper... papers he has repeatedly and for a very long time lied about. If he sold off all his properties, would he be rich? Multiple hundreds of millions, sure. Billionaire? Maybe.

No one will buy his properties from him at his asking prices, it's already known he vastly and ridiculously inflates them. Legitimate banks won't deal with him: he's been found guilty of large scale, long term fraud against the banks AND the federal government (which is an aspect the world and the US government seems to be largely ignoring.).

The forbes list operates largely on good faith, and publicly sourced information. They're not hiring forensic auditors and pouring over the intimate accounting details. Trump lied his way into everything, why not lie his way onto the forbes list?
 

Rhinox

too old for this
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Even before Truth Social, people who make it their business to know say he was a billionaire. The public can be fooled by spending $20 million a year, maybe, but I don't think Forbes is just watching that.
I don't actually recall that. I do seem to recall that the people who make it their business saying he wasn't nearly as rich as he let on, that he wasn't a billionaire.
Honestly, his net worth only really matters in terms of how he can pay his penalties, fines, and judgements. Given that he's struggled to make bail on some, I think the reality is that while he may be paper rich, he's money poor.
 

Axaday

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So 1) Forbes estimates $7.7 Billion now, despite Trump claiming higher.

2) My point didn't really depend on precise over and under $1 billion. He's a rich guy that could be doing classy things and going on adventures, but in reality he is crass and uncultured and really isn't interested in "the finer things" that wealthy people usually are. Everything he does is to prove to himself and others that he is somebody special.
 

NovaSaber

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Donald Trump on Saturday praised fictional serial killer Hannibal Lecter “as a wonderful man” before segueing into comments disparaging people who have immigrated into the US without permission.
The former president’s remarks to political rally-goers in Wildwood, New Jersey, as he challenges Joe Biden’s re-election in November were a not-so-subtle rhetorical bridge exalting Anthony Hopkins’ cannibalistic Lecter in Silence of the Lambs as “late [and] great” while simultaneously condemning “people who are being released into our country that we don’t want”.
Among other comments, Trump on Sunday also repeated exaggerations about having “been indicted more than the great Alphonse Capone”, the violent Prohibition-era Chicago mob boss.

"Only the best people"...
 

KidTDragon

Now with hi-res avatar!
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Fictional cannibalistic serial killer = great
Notorious mobster = great
Nazis marching in Charlottesville = very good people

It's so telling how he praises the worst humans the most.
 

Tuxedo Prime

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It should be noted that Dr. Lecter has a disturbingly large fanbase -- to the point where I'm not sure how he'd rate on the "man vs. bear" index. Being portrayed as a "man of culture" Villain Protagonist by both Sir Anthony Hopkins and Mads Mikkelsen will do that.

As to the rest....
 

Axaday

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I can't decide if I want context on praise for Hannibal Lector. Trump should not be impressed by the killing and cannibalism and probably isn't impressed by the "man of culture" part. What is there for him to like?
 
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Steevy Maximus

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A lot of people know the name. Trump has no idea who the guy is, but he's famous, so that means he's important, right?
Yeah, his use of “Late, great” indicates Trump thinks Lector was a real, but dead, individual. Even both actors that played the character are still alive so he can’t use that as an excuse.
 

Axaday

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So I went for context and it does appear to be a bad joke. In March he said "rough people, in many cases from jails, prisons, from mental institutions, insane asylums, … you know, insane asylums, that’s ‘Silence of the Lambs’ stuff. Hannibal Lecter, anybody know Hannibal Lecter? We don’t want ‘em in this country.” This time he asked the audience if they'd seen "Silence of the Lambs" and said "Hannibal Lecter is a wonderful man. He oftentimes would have a friend for dinner [crowd laughs]. Remember the last scene? He said he was having a friend for dinner". He knows who he is and was being sarcastic when he called him wonderful. It is all part of a bit he is doing about how the people coming in from Mexico are insane criminals. If I were his advisor, I would tell him to be careful not to make soundbytes like this and he would ignore me and apparently be right. His base don't care.

 

CoffeeHorse

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This is exactly why I used to watch his rallies and take my own notes. I don't envy any news journalist trying to cover them properly, because it is hard. They're full of partially told jokes like this, and they only get more fragmented with each telling. The base don't care because they've heard the full version and get it, but anyone out of the loop will be completely lost. He also does this thing where he'll start griping about something, but then he'll pause as the audience realizes they already what he's talking about, because they all saw the same FOX segment and it made them mad too. They know he must have seen the same segment they did. He pauses to let them know he knows they know. It makes sense on video, but if you're just reading a transcript it is complete gibberish.
 

Rhinox

too old for this
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It should be noted that Dr. Lecter has a disturbingly large fanbase -- to the point where I'm not sure how he'd rate on the "man vs. bear" index. Being portrayed as a "man of culture" Villain Protagonist by both Sir Anthony Hopkins and Mads Mikkelsen will do that.

As to the rest....
. . . I mean, I really did enjoy the books and the character.
 

Axaday

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If I thought he were clever, which I don't, I might suspect things like this were traps. Like when someone, probably Karl Rove, released a damaging document about George W Bush that ran for a media cycle and then someone, probably Karl Rove, pointed out that the document used a font that didn't exist when it was purported to be written, so the straight read was that some enemy of his had faked it to try to embarrass him.
 

Axaday

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I am really interested in hearing about cross-examination of Michael Cohen today or tomorrow. Trump himself has made it his main thrust against Cohen that he is a known and convicted liar, but since the lie he was convicted for was that he DID NOT PARTICIPATE IN THE VERY CRIME TRUMP IS ON TRIAL FOR, it is SUCH a weird spot for his lawyers. Michael Cohen plead guilty and served time for that lie, so he has already officially said it was a lie in open court and taken responsibility for his part in it. If they want to argue that he isn't credible here because he is a convicted liar, then they have to argue that his denial of this crime was in fact a lie. If it wasn't a lie, then his credibility is good and he was wrongfully prosecuted, a victim of the court system, and someone that should be their comrade in arms as representatives of another man being wrongfully prosecuted. His credibility should be very good. Except that he is going to say it WAS a lie and so the crime DID happen and he and Trump are both guilty....
 


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