Hasbr-uh-oh - Business and Tariffs Discussion

[LordGigaIce]

I had mostly the same thoughts in that Hasbro and Disney were probably the best match under the current circumstances, but... In a more positive light that didn't involve notions of "embarrassment" and "inability to move on".

But then I'm not particularly knowledgeable about the retail ups and downs of these over the last few years other than what little I come across here. Although I wouldn't say things are particularly rosy right now either.

Hasbro, if the quarterlies are to be believed, doesn't make much, if anything, on Star Wars and Marvel, so I have to think Chris Cocks' hack and slash would have gotten rid of them by now if not for some deeper attachment to the licences. Could be that Hasbro feels they're so associated with their brand that even if it's financially the right move to let them go, it would be a very bad look business and industry-wise. Could be they don't want to let them go because the inherent potential in those brands if they ever get hot again. Likely it's both.

And Disney... Disney just can't ask anyone but Hasbro to pay what they want for those licences, even if that asking price is what's keeping Hasbro from turning a profit on the properties.

For all we know, Disney acquiesced to both segments’ (ESPECIALLY Star Wars) lesser performance the past couple of years and Hasbro got some of the license costs reduced.

I suppose we'll find out soon enough. Hasbro is a publicly traded company and is required by law to publish quarterly financial reports available to the public. We'll find out soon enough if Disney cut them a deal.

 

[lastmaximal]

In any case it's in their best interests to stick together on this. Hasbro has a lot of weight to swing and the other options are either busy/loaded or not as appealing. And the Disney properties are still huge and recognizable. I'd want to hold on to those too as Hasbro, because I can't really coast on Transformers and Peppa Pig alone.

 

[Rhinox]

I agree with everyone that's said that the biggest issue with GI Joe not really taking off is the political climate we find ourselves in. Right now the military is a hard sell. They are not seen as heroes right now. We are not in a good place culturally. And until that changes GI Joe will continue to flounder. Doesn't matter the resources put into it.

 

[Cybersnark]

I agree with everyone that's said that the biggest issue with GI Joe not really taking off is the political climate we find ourselves in. Right now the military is a hard sell. They are not seen as heroes right now. We are not in a good place culturally. And until that changes GI Joe will continue to flounder. Doesn't matter the resources put into it.

(I still think now would be a good time to revisit Renegades.)

 

[Rhinox]

(I still think now would be a good time to revisit Renegades.)

. . . . . maybe.
it's a delicate thing, isn't it? You have the red hats on one side going all in on Jingo and on the other hand you have everyone else paying attention and just screaming into the ether. Does a toy company really want to dip even a single toe into that mess? Or avoid the entire thing, hope it all blows over soon?

 

[lastmaximal]

That's what I think Hasbro is doing by just letting Classified be its own thing, not attempting a show or movie in the meantime. Mine the nostalgia and the novelty of the new scale, let that drive a comfortable degree of sales, don't overreach just yet. (Who knows what'll happen if and when the TF/Joe crossover pushes through, but ugh I don't want to think about that terrible idea right now)

I've been saying this for like the last ten years plus, but any Joe revival would be best served by abandoning the military aesthetic and core concept entirely. Make it Adventure Team meets Overwatch, make it fun and weird.

The absurdity of the jingoism is at a fever pitch now, but the military stuff has been an albatross on the brand for at least a decade and a half.

 

[LordGigaIce]

Classified and the TF Collabs are the first new Joe things in a while that seems to have actually landed. I agree with lastmaximal. Just let them exist and make money off of nostalgia and try and wait it out until either the military becomes an earlier sell or you stumble on a million dollar idea to reinvent it.

 

[Anonymous X]

Just a reminder, GI Joe is still “Action Force” in my ageing brain, as the was the branding over here. To distance itself from the American origins, even back in the ‘80s. (IIRC some of the characters were changed to not be Americans on the packaging bios, something like that.)

 

[CoffeeHorse]

I would struggle to name three GI Joe characters but there's still been Classified stuff that caught my eye. I don't collect anything in that scale but if I did, Classified would be in the mix.

 

[LordGigaIce]

I would struggle to name three GI Joe characters but there's still been Classified stuff that caught my eye. I don't collect anything in that scale but if I did, Classified would be in the mix.

I have the first Cobra Commander they did and two Crimson Vipers.
That's all I plan on getting, but they're really good.

 

[lastmaximal]

It's a neat line and you can really see how into it the team is in every stream. (these streams are my favorite modern-era Hasbro thing, and I hope they never stop.)

Once they decided to just go all in on the more-faithful updates their audience really wanted anyway, they really hit their stride. I'm a bit surprised at how much product there is in that line, but I take that as a sign it's working. And by this point I think both Hasbro and that audience are fine with not gambling on more. For the moment at least.

 

[Sabrblade]

Just a reminder, GI Joe is still “Action Force” in my ageing brain, as the was the branding over here. To distance itself from the American origins, even back in the ‘80s. (IIRC some of the characters were changed to not be Americans on the packaging bios, something like that.)

At the moment, the Action Force brand is legally owned by Valaverse.

 

[lastmaximal]

I don't think the point was that GI Joe should rebrand as that.

 

[Platypus Prime]

Disney did have a deal with Super7, but supposedly they lost the license, reasons why seem to vary with who you ask. But most of them cite Disney being unhappy with Super7's comparatively low volume, and Hasbro has a LOT more to work with there. But at the same time, Hasbro itself has made deals with Super7 for lower-volume nostalgia stuff like the Reaction Plus GI Joes, and Playmates for higher-volume stuff like Power Rangers. Clearly, a lot is happening behind the scenes in every direction for licensing and IP, and not a bit of it makes sense to me, I just don't have the background.

 

[LBD "Nytetrayn"]

Spinmaster and PlayMates don't have the finances to even approach profitability either given how much it would cost them for the licences.

I'd love to know where the hell Playmates went wrong for this to be the case.

They had THE property of the late '80s and early '90s. TMNT was positively ginormous, and so was the toy line. For comparison, Pixel Dan is having to make at least two books, while Masters of the Universe had one, and that one was HUGE.

And as far as I know, their successive efforts with TMNT, while not reaching those levels, have mostly been successful (looking at you, Next Mutation), and they had all sorts of other popular brands, from Earthworm Jim to Darkwing Duck and Star Trek, at least in the '90s.

So why do they seem to be so lower-rung now? Did something go wrong? Did they invest too much into Chicken Run?

Just feels like they should be bigger now.

 

[lastmaximal]

Idk, I think TMNT was their only REALLY big thing going. And when that dried up it dried up HARD.

Is Pixel Dan going to be offering digital copies of those? But then again it'd be nice to have physical copies...

 

[Steevy Maximus]

I agree with everyone that's said that the biggest issue with GI Joe not really taking off is the political climate we find ourselves in. Right now the military is a hard sell. They are not seen as heroes right now. We are not in a good place culturally. And until that changes GI Joe will continue to flounder. Doesn't matter the resources put into it.

At this stage, I think the ONLY way for GI Joe to become a major mainstream brand is going to require a damn near complete overhaul of the brand concept. I still think the characters and underlying story elements are still viable, but is going to require some extreme repackaging and a LOT of investment to even have a chance. (For all its faults, GI Joe Extreme is basically “post-apocalyptic GI Joe”. And the brand found solid success in the early 2000s by treating its concepts and characters as “Superheroes without superpowers”).
But then, as you say, the current political climate would latch onto any major brand changes and create an unfavorable discourse for Hasbro.

Revamping GI Joe would basically take more resources, draw undesired perceptions, than ANYBODY involved feels is necessary at the moment. As lastmaximal pointed out, Classified is doing fine trucking along with what its doing, and the comic seems to be doing fine. Further, so long as Hasbro maintains Star Wars and Marvel licenses, there will always be a degree of competition. The last time Hasbro REALLY put a significant push into GI Joe was in 2002 after Hasbro had just lost Batman and DC.

Idk, I think TMNT was their only REALLY big thing going. And when that dried up it dried up HARD.

Basically…yeah.
Playmates really doesn’t have any house brands to fall back on. They live and die by their licenses. Playmates made MAJOR moves in the 90s on the back of that TMNT revenues, but nothing ever really had the legs of TMNT. Star Trek was big business until Star Wars came back and took over the toy aisle. Pretty much the only thing Playmates has going for it is TMNT…but even then, they’ve had to double down on the kids stuff and reissues because they’ve been run out of the collector space by Nickelodeon sub-licensing to NECA and TLS.


Something else to consider with Star Wars and its license cost: the license grants Hasbro a near-monopoly on anything close to a Star Wars figure. Relative to Marvel and most others, Hasbro’s Star Wars license is pretty expansive. Funko can’t make Star Wars POPs, they have to be BOBBLEHEADS. Lego can’t release mini-figures by themselves, they must be part of a CONSTRUCTION SET. Even the little bit that has been licensed out, Mattel got DIE CAST ship replicas and character cars. Jakks Pacific got the license for the PLASTIC scaled ship replicas.

 

[Blot]

I would struggle to name three GI Joe characters but there's still been Classified stuff that caught my eye. I don't collect anything in that scale but if I did, Classified would be in the mix.

Surely you can at least name Porkchop Sandwiches, Computer, and Body Massage?

 

[Steevy Maximus]

With all this discussion on tariffs and licensing, we missed Hasbro’s Q1 Financials!

Hasbro Powers Up Q1 Earnings With Magic-Driven Growth, Beats Expectations

From Magic to Monopoly, Hasbro’s heroes delivered in Q1, with big gains in gaming and strong showings from classic brands.

toybook.com

And an interview with CEO Chris Cocks:

Hasbro's Q1 Win Sets the Tone for Toy Industry Resilience

The Toy Book catches up with Hasbro CEO Chris Cocks for more insight into the company's Q1 2025 earnings and outlook.

toybook.com

Some broad notes to me:
Since taking over, Cocks direction has clearly shifted the company’s focus to Magic and digital gaming. For all intents and purposes, the upper management talks as though Hasbro is “the Magic The Gathering company” more than anything else. That said, Magic WAS the biggest driver of Q1, and is well insulated against potential tariff concerns. Hasbro remains bullish based on strong Q1 results and have NOT changed their yearly forecast. Hasbro currently has a 93-ish day supply of product on hand. Currently, 50% of Hasbro’s products are sourced from China, primarily consumer goods like toys. The way I’m reading it, before any mitigation, Hasbro is looking at a $100-300 million tariff loss.

During the interview, tariff concerns were raised, this was Cocks response (please control any laughing):

TB: Regarding tariffs, you mentioned planning for multiple outcomes, including sticking with a 145% duty on China and a 10% duty elsewhere. How could that impact consumer pricing across categories, from simple toys to the more complex, articulated offerings out of China, such as the collector lines and Hasbro Pulse products?
CC: With pricing category by category, mileage varies. For collectors, we get that a $40-50 action figure is a purchase from the heart. We’re not looking to nickel and dime anyone there. There will be no increase in the current preorder pricing for items that were ordered before the 145% kicked in. The price that was paid is the price.
When considering relocating production on items with a lot of deco or detail, including action figures and some of our role-play items, we will not cut corners. We will always choose the right manufacturing partner to ensure safety and quality. Then, we’ll look at the tariffs for pricing considerations

$40-50 Deluxe figures confirmed?! J/K…maybe…?

 

[The Mighty Mollusk]

Man, I'm glad I didn't want much coming out this year anyway.