Transformers Legacy toyline

[Onyx]

RID01 is still my fav series to date. Cybertron, Prime, Animated and Cyberverse fill out my top 5, (that aren't G1 continuity) great stand out characters and plot ideas. Would love to see Scattershot, Landmine, Wing Saber, Thunderblast, Crumplezone w/ Ransack, Airachnid, Lugnut, Clobber and Slipstream in Legacy.

G1 and BW will always be number 1 for me.

 

[LordGigaIce]

Prime has a lot going for it though.

Spoiler

That end of season 1 arc when you find that Unicron is Earth! Freaking crazy idea at the time!
Optimus losing his memory and joining up with his friend Megatronus.
3 Actual character deaths before we get to the end, not to mention the zombiefication of several of them.
Wreckers! We get wreckers for the first time!
The best Soundwave since G1.
Probably the best Starscream that we will ever get.
Bumblebee's first words are FREAKING EPIC!

A lot of folks didn't like animated, but it has some great things going too.

Spoiler

The Freaking Ark, that we have been seeing the entire show, gets magically repaired, and suddenly transforms into Omega Supreme!
"Decepticons! Transform and rise up!"
A competent Starscream that actually takes out Megatron himself and leads the Decepticons.
The main crew are just some no bodies, has-beens, and wash-outs on a back water world.
Freaking Tick chin!
Introduces some now staple characters.
Davd Kaye kills it as Optimus Prime!

I mean you're telling me stuff I already know. I watched both shows when they were airing

To me Animated just didn't jive for me. I can appreciate its quality, just wasn't for me though.
And Prime? I wanted to like Prime but they tried. So. Damn. Hard. To make everything epic that it becomes exhausting to watch.

And I mean I could list the genuinely good things about Armada I like but I'm sure you're well aware of them and nothing I say will change any minds. So it's probably best to agree to disagree on that.

 

[Superomegaprime]

Animated, hit its stride around the third season if you ask me, thou I not gone back and watched it same with Prime, thou honestly, my all time favourte series has to be RID2001, AKA Car Robots, it was self contained, not to serious, but had a lot of stand out characters, such as Hot Shot, his obession with Red Sports cars, Prowl being the no nonsance police officer, Cowboy X-Brawn, of course, the colourful cast helped the show to shine in my eyes, thou the ep I think was about the most humilating defeat for the Predacons was when they were beaten by a Steam train that wasn't even a Transformer!

 

[LordGigaIce]

I have yet to make it through the first half.

You're doing yourself a disservice.

 

[LordGigaIce]

Carlos is very dumb
Rad is very enthusiastic (and dumb)
Alexa is always over serious "mom" of the group
Fred is fat and whiny
Billy is a jerk

Ok. Teacher hat time.

Armada's not an expertly written show but as someone who teaches kids around the age of the Armada crew... they got a lot right?
Like often TF human kid sidekicks are Epic Protagonists of Destiny or super smart geniuses (Prime had both) but Armada's kids felt like... kids.

Also don't bodyshame.

 

[Lobjob]

Cyberverse is just incredible. I still can't believe it took me so long to watch it. Its near perfect. Im still in season three but its just loaded with all around wonderful stuff.

 

[Undead Scottsman]

Cyberverse suffers from being an 11 minute show, so while the plots are cool, there's basically little to no time for character development for 98% of the cast. It's a great ride, though.

 

[ZacWilliam1]

Ok. Teacher hat time.

Armada's not an expertly written show but as someone who teaches kids around the age of the Armada crew... they got a lot right?
Like often TF human kid sidekicks are Epic Protagonists of Destiny or super smart geniuses (Prime had both) but Armada's kids felt like... kids.

Also don't bodyshame.

Who was an "epic protagonist of destiny?" That doesn't really sound like any TF kid except maybe Sari and she was too grounded and goofy for that.

They just felt like badly written, unnecessarily annoying kids to me.

Also I was a fat kid and am a chubby adult (with Diabetes like Fred), I wasn't talking bad about Fred at all, the shows writers however absolutely treat "Fat" as one of his character traits and not particularly nicely. He's almost always talking about being hungry, and or whining about food and snacks and it's treated as something to laugh at. That's not very cool yeah, but that's on the show.

I don't hate the Armada kids, but I think the bad writing makes them come off as slow and obnoxious more frequently than it needs to, in a way that makes them less likeable to me than any other TF kid sidekicks I can think of. Less than nuanced voice acting/directing is probably part of that too.


-ZacWilliam, Maybe they get better though? I still havn't made it halfway through.

 

[CoffeeHorse]

Watch all the way through. It's slow but rewarding.

If nothing else, it has one of the best Optimus vs. Megatron/Galvatron fights of the entire franchise, I think. I used to rate it as THE best, but... we've had a lot since then. I'd need to rewatch and reevaluate the rest.

And I will continually advocate that it's a better fight because it happens in episode 52, not episode 26. We aren't just told how grand and old their rivalry is. It takes long enough to watch the whole show to feel some history when they have their final fight.

 

[LordGigaIce]

Who was an "epic protagonist of destiny?" That doesn't really sound like any TF kid except maybe Sari and she was too grounded and goofy for that.

Kicker had a fairly standard anime "angsty teen discovers great destiny" arc. Jack Darby from Prime had the "unassuming normal teenager finds out he's special" arc, right down to him being compared with Optimus Prime personally. Raf meanwhile was a hyper-intelligent genius.
Sari was literally an alien wunderkind, fulfilling both roles.

None of this means all of these characters, or any if you like them all, were bad. But they're all very... unique by virtue of the archetypes and tropes they fall into.
But the Armada kids just felt like... kids of that age who stumbled into some Transformers.

They just felt like badly written, unnecessarily annoying kids to me.

I say this with nothing but appreciation for my students in my heart- kids of that age are annoying. Even the "mature" ones
It's part of being that age. I was annoying at that age, so were you, so was everyone.
Again, they feel "real" to me in ways most other kid protagonists in TFers don't.

Also I was a fat kid and am a chubby adult (with Diabetes like Fred), I wasn't talking bad about Fred at all, the shows writers however absolutely treat "Fat" as one of his character traits and not particularly nicely.

I get that, I do. I donno. Maybe it's the MMPR fan in me but I just sort of slotted Billy and Fred into that "Bulk and Skull" archetype. Made me like both of them more.
But if the fat stuff bothered you that's valid. No defence of that.

Watch all the way through. It's slow but rewarding.



And I will continually advocate that it's a better fight because it happens in episode 52, not episode 26. We aren't just told how grand and old their rivalry is. It takes long enough to watch the whole show to feel some history when they have their final fight.

Agreed. I'd double down too. Armada's Prime/Megs showdown is the best the franchise has done.
None of the live action films really lived up to what could have been and none of the fights between them in the animated shows since has lived up to it.

 

[lastmaximal]

Defending the writing of the kids in Armada etc is like defending, say, heels (bad guys) in wrestling.

"Of course you don't like them, they're the bad guys, we're meant to hate them" only goes so far, as booing/disliking them can come from a character/narrative place (as it should), or just "this guy is boring/a terrible performer/unconvincing and I want to see someone else". Here it's not so much that the kids are "too real", it's that such behavior doesn't make for an egaging and entertaining viewing experience.

Yeah, kids in real life can be a pill. That doesn't mean they're enjoyable to watch in recurring roles in fiction when written that way, and it's far from useful as a blanket defense of such writing.

 

[Sabrblade]

A big issue with the Armada kids for me is the incongruities of their portrayal in how they are written, designed, animated, and voiced (the latter even applies for both the English and Japanese versions).

The five of them are all supposed to be middle school kids, yet they are drawn and voiced to look and sound more like high school kids, but the way they are written and animated makes their behavior resemble that of elementary school kids.

The end result makes the five of them look and sound older than they are, while acting much younger than they are. It's a very mixed portrayal overall.

 

[LordGigaIce]

Yeah, kids in real life can be a pill. That doesn't mean they're enjoyable to watch in recurring roles in fiction when written that way, and it's far from useful as a blanket defense of such writing.

I mean...
to me them being on the more realistic end of things adds to the show. I like the way they interact with each other and the Autobots. What can I say? They have a certain charm to their dynamic that I dig.

 

[Undead Scottsman]

The problem with accurately portraying something as annoying is that it is still annoying. It doesn't suddenly cease to be annoying because it's realistic or because it's art.

 

[Dake]

Yeah and cartoon kids tend to be more obnoxious really - because they're frequently only written that way and there's no correction for their behavior. You can write "real" kids that aren't irritating all the time, but that level of characterization is usually missing. For every Ahsoka who you get to watch grow and learn, there are dozens of one-note Dennis the Menace types.

 

[Sabrblade]

This is why I keep recommending Legends of the Microns over the Armada dub. It's more competently written and animated, with Rad and friends far more tolerable.

 

[CoffeeHorse]

The Armada kids are dreadful. The show would have been better without them, or they should have been sidelined as quickly as possible.

But they are not at all what I was thinking about when the show was over.

 

[Princess Viola]

This is why I keep recommending Legends of the Microns over the Armada dub. It's more competently written and animated, with Rad and friends far more tolerable.

counterpoint: not everyone wants to have to fuckin read while they're watching their over 20 year old children's cartoons

 

[Shadewing]

counterpoint: not everyone wants to have to fuckin read while they're watching their over 20 year old children's cartoons

I dont know if its due to my autism or what, but I can't do subs becuase my mind can either focus on trying to read what's being said, or whats going on screen. So I'll end up spending over an hour watching a 22 minute show, as I keep having to replay stuff to make sure I didnt miss anything.

 

[LordGigaIce]

I'm old school. My first exposure to anime was Dragon Ball Z, Pokemon, and YGO. I'm dub all the way. I love Armada and Cybertron's a guilty pleasure, but I have never felt compelled to watch subs of the original Japanese versions.