553 replies to this topic

[Lizard King]

Marvel hasn't let me down yet. I don't see them doing it now. I have the utmost confidence in this movie.

[Sockie]

It looks like the guy playing Coldblood is actually going to be HIGHLIGHT to view:
Iron Patriot. Sites are saying that's him in the suit.

[Daith]

Lil late to the party there ain't ya Sockie

[Sockie]

Bah. I didn't notice that someone else had pointed that out until now.

Edited by Sockie, 31 May 2012 - 05:19 PM.

[MsVirion]

If you want to know more about Hank Pym and his characterization, I urge you to read Mighty Avengers #21-31. Dan Slott made great strides in making him more than just the guy who hit his wife and made Ultron.

His Wasp persona was his best. I was disappointed when he went back to his older costumes.

[Chris McFeely]

[TM2-Megatron]

I know nothing about Iron Man villains, personally; just what I've seen so far in the films. Looking at the list of the "notable" ones that was posted earlier in this thread, I have to agree that his lineup isn't as good as that of other heroes. The only one of them I'd even heard of prior to the films getting me into Iron Man was Mandarin (and only very vaguely, from his cards in Marvel's Overpower CCG in the 90s), and I never even associated him with Iron Man since I never read the comics.

As long as the movies remain consistently enjoyable, whatever they do with the villains is fine with me. These movies may give them a chance to revise older villains, or even invent completely new ones.

[MsVirion]

Yeah...

The guy punches his wife in the face, gets kicked out of the Avengers, builds a mass-murdering robot, said mass-murdering robot tries to abduct his wife on numerous occassions and then she dies and he takes on her identity "out of respect".

Now somebody post a panel from that Geoff Johns comic where he shrinks down and crawls inside her vagina to give her an orgasm.

Hank Pym is just an absolute train wreck of a character.

He built Ultron, who turned on him and went "Rogue A.I." - suffers a mental breakdown after being exposed to a chemical which began to induce a schizophrenic mental condition - which created a more dominant personality (Yellowjacket), and he'd been the victim of brainwashing. He winds up facing a court martial which resulted in yet another mental breakdown, and it was during this that he backhanded Jan. Despite that in context (the man was suffering from years of untreated mental problems, stress, and repeated mental breakdowns) he has a better excuse than Peter did when he hit a pregnant MJ - Hank's never done anything but put the fault of what happened squarely on his own shoulders.

He's a tremendously flawed character, but he's hardly a trainwreck. He's a man who made numerous mistakes and has been attempting for years to make amends for them.



-Edit: My own order was a bit off, double checking what I remembered, fixed.

Edited by Matthias Phage, 31 May 2012 - 07:35 PM.

[Internet Jesus]

Wasp Hank is Best Hank.

I still don't get why they had him go back to being Giant-Man.

[ZacWilliam1]

Because Slott and Gage stuff does not have the clout at Marvel that it should I expect. I wish Slott had been in the architect role that ugh-Bendis has enjoyed. We'd have a much better Marvel Universe at this point I think.


-ZacWilliam, certainly one more to my liking.

[Sockie]

Because Slott and Gage stuff does not have the clout at Marvel that it should I expect. I wish Slott had been in the architect role that ugh-Bendis has enjoyed. We'd have a much better Marvel Universe at this point I think.


-ZacWilliam, certainly one more to my liking.

But... Gage is the one who sent Pym back to his Giant-Man identity.

Personally, I always preferred Lang or O'Grady as Ant-Man over Pym. Both are good. Although now that signs are pointing towards Lang becoming Ant-Man again, maybe O'Grady can become the new Yellowjacket. (Of course, with recent events in Secret Avengers...)

[Undead Scottsman]

Also, even IF comic Ant-Man is boring that doesn't mean his movie version has to be. It took the first Iron Man movie to catapult Iron Man and Tony Stark to Marvel's A-list. IIRC, he was mostly just a rich, smart playboy before then. After RDJ came the sarcastic, charming jackass. All it would take is a talented writer (which I implicable believe Edgar Wright to be) and director (Edgar Wright again) and a good actor to make him a stand-out character.

[Solarstorm]

I wasn't a big fan of Hank until his tenure as the Wasp. Since then, he's been on of my favorites.

As far as the Mandarin goes...

1)
In Iron Man: Director of SHIELD, he was brought back as a businessman who conned his way into political influence and defense contracts - which he used to fund turning Extremis into a bio weapon. His goal was in that arc was forcing humanity to improve, as the 25% that survived the virus would be powered and improved. I believe that he tied it to his Genghis Khan/conqueror obsession at one point in his rant. In that arc, he outmaneuvered Tony at every turn, leaving him locked out of the Iron Man suit by government order as the Mandarin readied his last attack. The rings were implanted into the Mandarin's spine, giving him extremis-like powers and the ability to survive the virus (as he was one of the 75% whose genetics were not compatible).

2)
The past year or more of Iron Man comics has also freed Obadiah Stane's son, planting a bomb inside of his body and forcing Stane to work on upgrading Iron Man's entire rogues gallery. He's had spymaster infiltrating and sabotaging Tony's new company as well. Following his earlier tactics, he's manipulated the military and media to lock Tony out of being Iron Man (he exposed Tony's lapse w/ alcohol from the Fear Itself event comics). Tony's been worn down steadily by his updated rogues and Stane has been working on a robot of mass destruction for the Mandarin, which is implied to be a design Tony had second thoughts on and nixed after he realized how dangerous it was. A one-shot "future" comic showed a world where the Mandarin ruled and where he had an army of those robots. Tony is currently at his breaking point and someone else is piloting a newly designed Iron Man suit.

--

The Mandarin has been a pretty consistent "big threat" for all of the recent comics. If anything, using him in the movie will be a great tie-in to the past two Iron Man runs, where he was the big bad (Iron Man: Director of SHIELD by the Knaufs, and Invincible Iron Man by Fraction).

So long as he's an evil businessman with some kind of intense plan - he'll be fine. If the plot is indeed Extremis - he's PART of the Extremis story. That run began with Ellis' Extremis story and ended with the Knauf's Mandarin one. Both focusing on Extremis.

Edited by Solarstorm, 31 May 2012 - 10:38 PM.

[NICK NEMESIS]

Should I read them?

Tony's one of my favorite characters but I haven't read his stories in years.

[Lizard King]

Iron Man comics have been pretty consistently good for a long time now, barring the occasional forced tie in

[Shadewing]

Also, even IF comic Ant-Man is boring that doesn't mean his movie version has to be. It took the first Iron Man movie to catapult Iron Man and Tony Stark to Marvel's A-list. IIRC, he was mostly just a rich, smart playboy before then. After RDJ came the sarcastic, charming jackass. All it would take is a talented writer (which I implicable believe Edgar Wright to be) and director (Edgar Wright again) and a good actor to make him a stand-out character.

Yes, but Iron Man has still had GOOD stories even when he was just the "rich, smart, and occasionally alcoholic playboy" He was never a key play till the past decade or so (his rise to A list started before the movies, imo) but still ended up having more then a few memorable stories, such as the first bout with alcoholism which is still one of the better stories about the subject in comics, or the one where he and Doom went to Camelot, The Armor Wars, just to name a few. He also had his own Cartoon in the 90's which was pretty decent for the time (not great, and kinda hard to watch some episodes nowadays, but good at the time) which helped some kids get into his character. He's got a big spring for people to draw from to create an "idealized" version for the movies.

That all to me is a key difference to Ant-Man, look at this thread most people have to struggle to remember his good points. I'm not saying its impossible to make him likable, just that whoever tries is going to have a bigger uphill battle then they would for almost any other hero. He's not got any really impressive powers "control bugs" isn't going to impress the general public, I don't think Shrinking will either. Yeah it will lead to some impressive visuals, but I'm not sure how well that would work in a superhero action movie; and don't kid yourselves that is what the general public will go in expecting it to be. Giant-Man might work, with him basically becoming an intelligent Hulk-lite hero, but that seems to go against his more pacafistic nature and not wanting to be a superhero that we see, if EHM is anything to go by as that is pretty much his one note there. So far about the only good thing of introducing Hank Pym into the Movieverse, is just to introduce other better and more popular characters.

[Undead Scottsman]

Wasn't his pacifism mostly an EMH thing?

And if the guy who made Shaun of the Dead and Hot Fuzz thinks he can do something great with the character, then I'm going to believe that great things can be done with the character.

[Solarstorm]

Should I read them?

Tony's one of my favorite characters but I haven't read his stories in years.

Like Nickstart said, the comics have been good for a long time now. However, I still prefer the last volume. It starts with the Extremis arc by Warren Ellis and the title changes to Iron Man:Director of SHIELD after the Civil War crossover.

IMDoS was firing on all cylinders towards the end, but Fraction's comic started to ship 2-3 months before it was even over. The Knaufs wrote a nuanced Tony and a darker book. Fraction's run has been good, but it was rushed out to start shifting Iron Man from Civil War villain to movie hero.

Edited by Solarstorm, 01 June 2012 - 06:17 AM.

[Sean Whitmore]

Iron Man comics have been pretty consistently good for a long time now, barring the occasional forced tie in

Absolutely. From Warren Ellis to the Knaufs to Fraction, Iron Man's been good to great for most of the last decade, which a lot books can't claim. The worst stories have been related to Fear Itself, Civil War, etc.

[Lizard King]

Yeah, something like that. It's way, way cooler when you actually read the stories though.