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@  Tm_Silverclaw : (20 July 2019 - 10:40 AM)

I don't suppose the allspark has any criminal lawyers from Georgia. ;P

@  NotVeryKnightly : (19 July 2019 - 01:17 PM)

It seems like, with these kind of things, anything not TF-specific is either in an existing thread or just not discussed since they're not part of something deemed important enough to get its own thread already.

@  Benbot : (19 July 2019 - 12:45 PM)

Yeah, but it's for Transformers specifically

@  Gryllid : (19 July 2019 - 12:39 PM)

There is. It's called "SDCC 2019 thread"

@  Benbot : (19 July 2019 - 12:24 PM)

no general SDCC thread?

@  Benbot : (19 July 2019 - 12:08 PM)

I never even bothered to see it.

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (19 July 2019 - 10:30 AM)

O never hated it, the whole thing was an Indiana Jones movie. I didn't care for the CGI, but that's just nature of the beast.

@  Paladin : (19 July 2019 - 07:58 AM)

sidebar- has enough time passed that we can stop irrationally hating "Crystal Skull" yet?

@  Telly : (18 July 2019 - 09:18 PM)

after 38 years and i dont know how many viewings, today is the first time i noticed indiana jones doesnt use a revolver in the bar fight in raiders...

@  Kalidor : (18 July 2019 - 05:33 PM)

@Sabrblade Depends on when you're here. I used to have the backups happen once daily, now I have them happen once per hour so you might often see a hesitation at the top of every hour for 30-45 seconds.

@  Locoman : (18 July 2019 - 05:11 PM)

isn't that just Modern Family

@  Foffy : (18 July 2019 - 04:45 PM)

that's right. my gym teacher is a clown. new series coming to disney channel next fall

@  Foffy : (18 July 2019 - 04:44 PM)

all these clowns are making me run really fast.

@  Sabrblade : (18 July 2019 - 12:10 PM)

All this awesome SDCC news is really making these boards run slowly.

@  Bass X0 : (18 July 2019 - 07:54 AM)

Racism must be stopped. No matter the cost.

@  MEDdMI : (18 July 2019 - 07:49 AM)

Tine to stop buttering it up.

@  PlutoniumBoss : (17 July 2019 - 09:43 PM)

Well shucks.

@  ▲ndrusi : (17 July 2019 - 08:14 PM)

The joke is a husk of its former self.

@  Paladin : (17 July 2019 - 01:15 PM)

Pop.

@  Shrug : (17 July 2019 - 10:15 AM)

Something something... corn bread?

@  MEDdMI : (17 July 2019 - 07:21 AM)

Ok, ok. Enough of the puns and let's all thank Kal for the amaizeing job he did.

@  Paladin : (17 July 2019 - 06:24 AM)

by now I think this jokes' been creamed.

@  Nevermore : (17 July 2019 - 03:31 AM)

The kernel.

@  Nevermore : (17 July 2019 - 03:31 AM)

Who gives the orders in cybernetic warfare?

@  unluckiness : (16 July 2019 - 09:59 PM)

Zea mays

@  Xellos : (16 July 2019 - 09:53 PM)

Isn't that a kernel of truth.

@  Paladin : (16 July 2019 - 08:43 PM)

huh. suddenly the Squawk is popping.

@  TheMightyMol... : (16 July 2019 - 07:47 PM)

Not placing much stalk in this conversation.

@  Nevermore : (16 July 2019 - 06:22 PM)

That's so corny.

@  Shrug : (16 July 2019 - 06:07 PM)

It's absurd how happy I am that a post of mine made the front page of Reddit.

@  TheMightyMol... : (16 July 2019 - 05:46 PM)

Aww, shucks.

@  TriBlurr : (16 July 2019 - 05:45 PM)

Not till I taste the corn

@  Kalidor : (16 July 2019 - 05:43 PM)

You guys aren't being very nice. You're supposed to tell me I did "good, really good!"

@  TheMightyMol... : (16 July 2019 - 05:40 PM)

Just don't go beyond the rows.

@  Patch : (16 July 2019 - 05:39 PM)

Left over from the failed Beast Machines sequel, Beast Farmers

@  Patch : (16 July 2019 - 05:39 PM)

It's techno-organic corn

@  TriBlurr : (16 July 2019 - 05:26 PM)

We have a cornfield? Can I get a few ears?

@  Kalidor : (16 July 2019 - 12:56 PM)

And lastly, if it becomes too much hassle to deal with - it might just get sent into the cornfield and replaced with a Discord box anyway. So cool it.

@  Kalidor : (16 July 2019 - 12:55 PM)

Second thing is we do actually have the ability to ban users specifically from using Shoutbox if it's being abused like that

@  Kalidor : (16 July 2019 - 12:55 PM)

Hey all - just a reminder and heads up. The Shoutbox has been kept here as a courtesy because it's what you folks like in lieu of Discord - but a few things to remember is that P&R should stay in P&R and isn't really something that needs to be dragged out here in the most public of spaces.

@  Nevermore : (16 July 2019 - 11:04 AM)

Done.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (16 July 2019 - 10:25 AM)

You can make a new one. I doubt anybody would stop you.

@  Nevermore : (16 July 2019 - 10:16 AM)

There was a thread but it appears to have disappeared. Might have been lost in one of the older forum sweeps.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (16 July 2019 - 09:58 AM)

Yeah this is pretty much circumventing the fact that we have different rules for political talk.

@  fourteenwings : (16 July 2019 - 09:55 AM)

Okay, so, basically, can we not do politics in here anymore? I mean, considering how often @Nevermore, you talk about your work conditions, don't you think it's time for a dedicated thread in P&R?

@  unluckiness : (16 July 2019 - 09:39 AM)

Scratch that; that's insulting to honest salads. Whatever that was was the text equivalent of hamburger.

@  unluckiness : (16 July 2019 - 09:38 AM)

Would you like some dressing to go with your word salad?

@  Paladin : (16 July 2019 - 09:34 AM)

yes; it now goes "shit piss hug *BLEEP* ^$@^ motherhuger **** turd fart encyclopedia & Socialism."

@  unluckiness : (16 July 2019 - 09:24 AM)

This is an American site, but isn't that unnecessarily severe language? IIRC it's one of the top four offensive pejoratives to English people

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (16 July 2019 - 08:52 AM)

It's amusing how so many (U.S.) wankers in this world love to whine "capitalism good socialism bad!" in the abstract while simultaneously pretending that megacorporations dominating de facto monopolies is anathema to the core capitalistic principle of competition benefits everyone.


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Some musings about TMS


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15 replies to this topic

#1 Mark Pellegrini

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Posted 03 July 2011 - 10:14 PM

.


Edited by Mark Pellegrini, 02 May 2014 - 12:52 PM.


#2 Monzo

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 12:30 AM

If you're interested in other TMS co-productions, you may want to check out an episode or two of The Bionic Six. It was basically an '80s advertoon almost entirely helmed by them (so I recall) - the plots were hit or miss, since it was an action-comedy series, but I can still remember some mind-blowing animated sequences cropping up. For pure visuals, try checking out the episode that Wikipedia tells me was called "Once Upon A Crime" (specifically a fight with an ogre-robot near the end of it), while I remember the episodes "Kaleidoscope" and "The Perceptor File" being among the better-written (though the latter was still pretty dumb with its science).

The episodes all seem to be up on Google Video, though are Nth-generation TV rips. Oh well. At least the opening sequence is still gorgeous.



EDIT: Oh. And the teenage girl is pretty insufferable as a character. I guess I should forewarn there, because "Once Upon A Crime" focuses on her.

Edited by Monzo, 04 July 2011 - 01:10 AM.


#3 Sprocket

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 01:12 AM

It's a shame they wasted so much time on Sonic X. Lord was that show a mediocre waste.

I can't help but think part of the issue is the increased competition. South Korea's really stepped up their game since the turn of the century: Dong Woo, Lotto, Rough Draft...yeah, they're not perfect, but it's a hell of a jump from the action cartoons of the '90s.

Too bad Green Lantern's in CGI: I'm sure TMS would have been on Timm's shortlist otherwise.
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#4 2019

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 01:24 AM

SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIICCCCCCCCCCC ECKKKKKKS

PM me if you're bored!


#5 Weremole

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 05:37 AM

Bakugan is funded by Nelvana if I remember it right. They might not have a lot of money either or Spinmaster itself lacks dough.

I think it depends on how many Dr Movie credits there are.

#6 Tyranno

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 08:54 AM

I liked Sonic X. :<

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#7 000

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 09:55 AM

I had no idea that TMS was working for WB Animation again. Back during Justice League, someone on Toonzone (maybe Timm himself) said that they didn't have the money to use TMS, so I'd kinda written them off afterwards. I'll have to give First Flight another watch, although nothing really stood out to me the first time I saw it.

And it's very possible that their best animators from the 90's have gone on to other things. I remember in the commentary for B:TAS's "Heart of Ice" that that episode was animated by a studio founded by ex-TMS employees, but they sadly went under shortly after it was finished. Not sure how easy it would be for anyone outside the industry (and country) to track down their staff though.

#8 Spark

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 02:11 PM

The thing I always love about TMS is how they handled shadows. Their work was always instantly recognizable because they used high contrast shadows and lots of black, which I loved, whereas the other studios almost always either used shadows a few shades below the base color or none at all some times. And TMS' shadows used to move a lot, making the animation seem really dynamic.

It's really obvious on the Mighty Orbots intro in particular:

Fall of Cybertron will blow your mind. That is all.

#9 Detour

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 04:32 PM

So what episode of TRGB did TMS animate? Because aside from the two episodes included with the GB2 DVD, I've not really seen any in a while, and you've got me intrigued about the TMS ones now.

You're far too young to be this bitter and angry at the world....

I'm reading that with Roy's voice. Heck, I read everything you post in a laconic Irish accent.

 


#10 Spark

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 04:51 PM

I'm pretty sure they at least did a lot of the first season. "Knock-knock" and "Devil to Pay" definitely look like theirs.
Fall of Cybertron will blow your mind. That is all.

#11 HellCat

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 08:06 PM

My opinions of TMS are forever ruined by a nut at another forum. He believed that if TMS ever animated something this meant they owned the characters. Thus his insane logic was TMS should 'fix' any show he didn't like by adding in one that he did. His constant example was that TMS should make Family Guy because then they'd make Pinky and the Brain the new stars, along with Sonic and Tails.

The internet, ladies and gentlemen. It's why we can't have nice things.

#12 Esser-Z

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 08:12 PM

I am impressed. That's quite the crazy.

Edited by Esser-Z, 04 July 2011 - 08:12 PM.


#13 HellCat

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Posted 04 July 2011 - 09:29 PM

QUOTE(DrSpengler @ Jul 4 2011, 08:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(HellCat @ Jul 4 2011, 09:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
My opinions of TMS are forever ruined by a nut at another forum. He believed that if TMS ever animated something this meant they owned the characters. Thus his insane logic was TMS should 'fix' any show he didn't like by adding in one that he did. His constant example was that TMS should make Family Guy because then they'd make Pinky and the Brain the new stars, along with Sonic and Tails.

The internet, ladies and gentlemen. It's why we can't have nice things.


Just hearing you talk about it almost ruins TMS for me.

We are no longer on speaking terms.


Hey, I'm the victim here. The crazies and the stupids seem to gravitate towards me. I just wanna enjoy good quality animation with the rest of you.

Just not those infamous dance cycles I believe they did for Scooby Doo and Tiny Toons.

#14 Spark

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Posted 05 July 2011 - 01:41 AM

QUOTE(HellCat @ Jul 4 2011, 10:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(DrSpengler @ Jul 4 2011, 08:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(HellCat @ Jul 4 2011, 09:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
My opinions of TMS are forever ruined by a nut at another forum. He believed that if TMS ever animated something this meant they owned the characters. Thus his insane logic was TMS should 'fix' any show he didn't like by adding in one that he did. His constant example was that TMS should make Family Guy because then they'd make Pinky and the Brain the new stars, along with Sonic and Tails.

The internet, ladies and gentlemen. It's why we can't have nice things.


Just hearing you talk about it almost ruins TMS for me.

We are no longer on speaking terms.


Hey, I'm the victim here. The crazies and the stupids seem to gravitate towards me. I just wanna enjoy good quality animation with the rest of you.

Just not those infamous dance cycles I believe they did for Scooby Doo and Tiny Toons.

I was like, "Wow, that IS crazy! Who would think-" then I saw "Sonic and Tails" at the end and it suddenly made sense.
Fall of Cybertron will blow your mind. That is all.

#15 JonT

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Posted 05 July 2011 - 04:31 AM

The official line on the syndicated season of The Real Ghostbusters is that TMS were responsible for the entire season. Of course, some episodes are clearly better than others, and this can also be seen in The Adventures of the Galaxy Rangers, whose 65 episodes were also completely animated by TMS, but the quality is similarly all over the place. While Ghostbusters and Galaxy Rangers have their fair share of amazingly-animated episodes, it's TMS' work on other series that tends to stand out more since they worked on less episodes of each, and thus almost consistently used their "A-Team", perhaps most noticeable on their Warner series.

Like Toei, some of their best animation was indeed produced for U.S. series, presumably due to the dollar stretching further. There's still some cool anime productions they've been involved in though, such as the perennial Lupin III, or the multiple productions directed by the late Osamu Dezaki, particularly the criminally unlicensed (and yes, hopelessly dated) Space Adventure Cobra TV series.

As for the DIC stuff appearing pale, I always attributed that to the film-to-video transfer technology of the time, which was pretty ropey in the mid-80s.

With their seeming inability to produce anything less than a decently animated production at worst back in the 80s/90s, it's little wonder that no less than Disney used them so much for their initial ongoing TV series. More surprising was TMS' work on Filmation's The New Adventures of Zorro in 1981, possibly their first outsourced production (it's a toss up between this and DIC's superb Ulysses 31). Apparently, they really had to reign themselves in to make sure they fit with the infamous Filmation style!

It's not all roses, of course, when you consider the animation disaster that was Spider-Man: The Animated Series. Aside from the pilot episode, "Night of the Lizard", and some elements of the first season, you'd be hard-pressed to tell that TMS actually animated the entire series, what with numerous four-frame per second shots that cropped up regularly. That was one that was ruined by lack of funding and some fundamental problems in editing the animation together; any bits the producers didn't like were simply replaced by repeated animation, even over dialogue scenes. Complete with patented jaggy lines!

In the end, some of their best ever TV work has to be Mighty Orbots, with truly breathtaking animation across each episode of its short season, and of course their work on Batman, with "Feat of Clay Part II" as the absolute highlight.

It's a pity Warner and DC mostly dropped the studio before Batman Beyond aired, but with a rumored price of a couple of hundred dollars per cel, cost was clearly the main reason why they were dropped.

Edited by JonT, 05 July 2011 - 04:39 AM.


#16 JonT

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Posted 05 July 2011 - 04:18 PM

QUOTE(DrSpengler @ Jul 5 2011, 11:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
TMS's staff was listed in the credits across the entire syndicated season, but those were static credits that never even listed guest voices, so I'm not sure they accurately reflect the actual production crew of each given episode. For instance, "Knock, Knock" was from the syndicated season (first in production, at that) and was done by Ajia-Do, not TMS. Likewise, I suspect "Venkman's Ghost Repellers" and "Ghostfight at the Ok Corral" were Ajia-Do productions, too, but I can't be sure on them.


TMS were apparently the official animation company of choice for the syndicated season of RGB, according to a friend of mine who worked on the TimeLife DVDs. In the case of "Knock Knock", Ajia-Do were possibly sub-contracted by TMS to do the episode, or perhaps even just some short sequences. Stuff like this goes on all the time with anime studios, which is why on actual anime productions that are granted the courtesy of complete credits, unlike the block credits of 80s U.S. series, you'll find a lot of other animation studios listed in addition to the ostensible "main" one. This does all admittedly obfuscate exactly who did what when obsessives like us analyze this stuff years later! icon-hotrod.gif

QUOTE(DrSpengler @ Jul 5 2011, 11:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I almost want to give them a "pass" on the awfulness of the 90s Spider-Man cartoon since by the looks of it the show seemed to be trying out some sort of new technology; like it was being drawn using primitive tablets instead of traditional pencil/paper, making the characters look all digitally choppy with those "pixilated" outlines and such.


With Spider-Man, the producers were indeed trying out new technology as you surmised. They used digital coloring, in addition to the hideously dated CG backgrounds that the producers eventually lessened the use of, presumably since they looked so laughably bad even for the time. Perhaps with Marvel Films' obsession with such new technology, TMS just couldn't do any decent work, aside from the pilot episode of course, the only one of the whole series that actually looks like a TMS episode.

QUOTE(DrSpengler @ Jul 5 2011, 11:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Wikipedia says that TMS only supervised the animation which was done in Korea, but well, Wikipedia.


There are a few Korean names that crop up on later episodes, so a Korean "satellite" studio of TMS was likely involved, but that's still no excuse for just how bad the animation could be at times, and especially with no less than TMS still technically being responsible for it, as their credit on all 65 episodes attests. Maybe DC/Warner saw how TMS handled such work on a lower budget and simply thought "no way!" for the better part of a decade.