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@  Dekafox : (19 February 2020 - 06:14 PM)

Count Zero?

@  TheMightyMol... : (19 February 2020 - 03:53 PM)

Oh boy, here we go.

@  ▲ndrusi : (19 February 2020 - 02:34 PM)

Or do Japan's cultural values vary depending on exactly who you're trying to shut down?

@  ▲ndrusi : (19 February 2020 - 02:33 PM)

Could it be that, perhaps, these different cultural values might lead to a different approach seeming appropriate?

@  ▲ndrusi : (19 February 2020 - 02:32 PM)

Hm. Back when we were arguing about the Legends comic, I seem to recall being repeatedly told that Japan had different cultural values than the US (and therefore anyone who had a problem with anything at all was wrong to voice that opinion ever).

@  fourteenwings : (19 February 2020 - 07:23 AM)

Plus, as much as I hate to admit it, every single anime character is built to suit the audience's tastes so they buy more merch/do other things that allow $$$ to flow in the production committees direction, so the authenticity is certainly not for representation's sake.

@  fourteenwings : (19 February 2020 - 07:18 AM)

Both those anime air at midnight and are aimed at a very specific audience in a whole other media landscape. Major projects have press releases about almost everything, and there are groups just waiting to pat anybody on the back for doing what they want (GLAAD, HRC, etc)

@  B-Fox : (19 February 2020 - 03:16 AM)

It's funny that a friggin' anime about zombie idols and an anime about a school of anthropomorphic animals can have really positive trans characters WITHOUT a press release about their inclusion in the series prior to the episodes airing or having the creators announcing it on social media and patting themselves on the back for doing a thing.

@  TriBlurr : (18 February 2020 - 10:26 PM)

Vegan meat needs bacon

@  Paladin : (18 February 2020 - 08:43 PM)

vegan meat must taste delicious. they're grass-fed and regularly exercised....

@  wonko the sane? : (18 February 2020 - 06:57 PM)

Vegans are better than kids if you don't talk to them. They'll keep the lawn trimmed anyway.

@  TheMightyMol... : (18 February 2020 - 06:02 PM)

Do you want vegans? Because that's how you get vegans.

@  CORVUS : (18 February 2020 - 04:33 PM)

Hook up your sprinkler system to a canister of healthy organic carrot-juice. The kids won't be able to get off your lawn fast enough.

@  TheMightyMol... : (18 February 2020 - 03:59 PM)

Just use the hose.

@  wonko the sane? : (18 February 2020 - 03:52 PM)

Ask bing. It'll be a FAR more effective answer.

@  TrnsfrmGod : (18 February 2020 - 03:26 PM)

Google, how do I get those durned kids off my lawn?

@  TrnsfrmGod : (18 February 2020 - 03:26 PM)

Please ignore.  Old man here apparently doesn't know the difference between the "Search" field and the "Shoutbox" field.

 

Also doesn't know how to delete from the shoutbox

@  wonko the sane? : (18 February 2020 - 07:33 AM)

Huhn. Penny arcade was right, the division 2 is literally 3 dollars...

@  Steevy Maximus : (17 February 2020 - 11:05 PM)

Oh, Wicked Cool Toys got the Halo toy license. This is a big year for Jazwares

@  Steevy Maximus : (17 February 2020 - 07:02 PM)

iTunes/Apple TV has the complete Cowboy Bebop series for just $5!

@  fourteenwings : (17 February 2020 - 12:41 AM)

The Samsung Galaxy B-TOOM!

@  Paladin : (16 February 2020 - 07:20 PM)

business is booming.

@  wonko the sane? : (16 February 2020 - 06:49 PM)

SAmsung has you covered. Exploding phones.

@  Patch : (16 February 2020 - 05:21 PM)

Modern problems require modern solutions.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (16 February 2020 - 05:21 PM)

Japan seems to have a tradition of murder things where cellphones facilitate the killing instead. Like King's Game and Doubt.

@  TheMightyMol... : (16 February 2020 - 05:17 PM)

Or there's just conveniently no reception, or all of their phones are dead at the same time. Or they're just stupid and forget about them.

@  Patch : (16 February 2020 - 04:41 PM)

Now the slasher villain has to go and knock over the nearest cell tower before butchering horny teenagers.

@  TheMightyMol... : (16 February 2020 - 03:54 PM)

Think of all the horror and mystery movies that involve the bad guys cutting the phone line. Now think about how many people don't even have a land line to cut anymore.

@  Telly : (16 February 2020 - 03:47 PM)

its like that scene in commando. the bad guy has to get to a phone to call the big bad to tell him arnold isnt on the plane. that wouldnt happen today

@  Rycochet : (16 February 2020 - 03:18 PM)

Watching early episodes of the x-files will make you feel super old once you start to notice the techology they use, and the technology they lack.

@  Maximus Ambus : (16 February 2020 - 01:00 PM)

This guy.

@  Roddie Luver : (15 February 2020 - 10:55 PM)

Hey

@  Kalidor : (14 February 2020 - 03:01 PM)

The ones that get me are the "Uploaded 12 years ago" ones

@  TheMightyMol... : (14 February 2020 - 02:49 PM)

Makes you feel old, don't it?

@  Maximus Ambus : (14 February 2020 - 02:38 PM)

While browsing Youtube vids I read these comments: 'The X Files is such an underrated show' and another 'Brent Spiner is a underrated actor' I want to punch something.

@  wonko the sane? : (14 February 2020 - 12:16 PM)

Besides: cupid freaks me out. "Find someone to love, or I'll SHOOT YOU".

@  TheMightyMol... : (14 February 2020 - 12:11 PM)

It's just the day before Cheap Chocolate Day.

@  wonko the sane? : (14 February 2020 - 12:08 PM)

Meh, just more game time.

@  Paladin : (14 February 2020 - 10:55 AM)

Valentine's day. Bummer.

@  Otaku : (14 February 2020 - 10:41 AM)

So is that an occasion for congratulations or condolences, Telly?  I see it as a good thing, but that is a matter of personal preference; easier for me to keep straight who is who when the names don't change. XP

@  Telly : (14 February 2020 - 12:48 AM)

damn. ive been going by "telly" on here for nearly 14 years...

@  TM2-Megatron : (11 February 2020 - 08:06 PM)

I've seen it. It didn't really deliver on the title

@  Paladin : (11 February 2020 - 05:28 PM)

we don't need to see that. we're living it.

@  Maximus Ambus : (11 February 2020 - 03:42 PM)

Anyone seen an old British movie called 'The Earth dies screaming' it's like a Doctor Who serial minus the Doctor.

@  TriBlurr : (09 February 2020 - 11:58 AM)

Needs more zone defense. Call Scrapper

@  TheMightyMol... : (09 February 2020 - 11:29 AM)

MORE POINTS FOR BLITZWING!

@  Donocropolis : (09 February 2020 - 09:33 AM)

MP-7 Thundercracker recovers....he's at the 40....the 20....AND HE SCORES!

@  PlutoniumBoss : (08 February 2020 - 10:37 PM)

Reserved for Masterpiece Kup.

@  Sabrblade : (08 February 2020 - 09:49 PM)

MP-10 Convoy redecoed.

@  TheMightyMol... : (08 February 2020 - 06:56 AM)

MP-9 Rodimus self-destructed.


Photo
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Wikipedia help from Fun Pub


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291 replies to this topic

#241 NotVeryKnightly

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 01:42 PM

QUOTE(mignash @ Jan 12 2011, 02:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Exdept of course some jokers keep removing the Botcon toys from being mentioned in the Botcon article. After all, how important are exclusive collectable toys to a TOY COLLECTORS CONVENTION!

I also noticed that the artlcle on TFCon got deleted recently, and it had a lot of cited media coverage.

What, you think all articles on collectors' conventions need a list of every single toy it's ever released?

#242 Jeysie

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 01:43 PM

QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 01:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
"Timelines as a collective" is a bit complicated, considering that connections between universes are found on things not called Timelines.

So? Connections between universes are irrelevant to Timelines status as a brand and franchise. You don't need that connection within Timelines fiction because they don't need to be connected to qualify as a brand. After all, we're not sitting here arguing that Transformers itself isn't a real brand or franchise even though it includes several dozen different subfranchises, toylines, continuities, etc.

Sources which refer to "Shattered Glass", "TransTech", etc. are acceptable because those universes are a part of the accepted Timelines brand. If people don't understand that, that's the point of an article to begin with; to teach them that's how it works.

This isn't rocket science, dude. Most of your arguments are based on things that either are irrelevant, inconsistent, or are more complicated than the situation actually is, and it's getting a little annoying hearing the same broken record after this has been pointed out to you.

#243 GlassBeadGame

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 01:45 PM

QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 07:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Anyways, on the topic of the Timelines page getting deleted on WP, it was established at some point that a source writing on Timelines as a collective would have really helped to convince people to keep it. Perhaps other stuff would have, but not mentions of individual toys or comic reviews with no plot synopsis or explanations of individual plot points.


In any discussion where as many delete votes as that don't even have a basis in reality, convincing people to change their minds is a bit like convincing them to defy gravity.

#244 NightViper

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 01:50 PM

QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 01:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(mignash @ Jan 12 2011, 02:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Exdept of course some jokers keep removing the Botcon toys from being mentioned in the Botcon article. After all, how important are exclusive collectable toys to a TOY COLLECTORS CONVENTION!

I also noticed that the artlcle on TFCon got deleted recently, and it had a lot of cited media coverage.

What, you think all articles on collectors' conventions need a list of every single toy it's ever released?


For completeness sake, it would be nice.

It's not like we're talking about a ginormous toy line consisting of thousands of entries; I think it would be more than reasonable to have a list of all the toys that a convention known for having exclusive toys has released.


#245 (Deactivated) mignash

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 01:54 PM

QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 01:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(mignash @ Jan 12 2011, 02:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Exdept of course some jokers keep removing the Botcon toys from being mentioned in the Botcon article. After all, how important are exclusive collectable toys to a TOY COLLECTORS CONVENTION!

I also noticed that the artlcle on TFCon got deleted recently, and it had a lot of cited media coverage.

What, you think all articles on collectors' conventions need a list of every single toy it's ever released?


Well, we could have just put the Botcon toys on the Transformers: Timelines page, but then some joker ran a several week long campaign posting over 40 messages as part of a self-described "campaign of deletion" to get that one erased!

#246 NotVeryKnightly

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 01:58 PM

QUOTE(mignash @ Jan 12 2011, 02:54 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 01:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(mignash @ Jan 12 2011, 02:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Exdept of course some jokers keep removing the Botcon toys from being mentioned in the Botcon article. After all, how important are exclusive collectable toys to a TOY COLLECTORS CONVENTION!

I also noticed that the artlcle on TFCon got deleted recently, and it had a lot of cited media coverage.

What, you think all articles on collectors' conventions need a list of every single toy it's ever released?


Well, we could have just put the Botcon toys on the Transformers: Timelines page, but then some joker ran a several week long campaign posting over 40 messages as part of a self-described "campaign of deletion" to get that one erased!

"Campaign of deletion" as in those 3 words consecutively, is you're own. Am pretty sure that exact word string didn't come up before you used it. Notin aything relevant to this.

Edited by Item42, 11 January 2011 - 02:00 PM.


#247 (Deactivated) mignash

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 02:10 PM

Your quote from the tfwiki "big-time deletion campaign." Not a campaign to correct, improve, add sources to, or clean up the articles. A campaign to delete them!

So except for the precise wording everything is true?

Edited by mignash, 11 January 2011 - 02:13 PM.


#248 (Deactivated) mignash

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 02:15 PM

QUOTE(NightViper @ Jan 11 2011, 01:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 01:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(mignash @ Jan 12 2011, 02:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Exdept of course some jokers keep removing the Botcon toys from being mentioned in the Botcon article. After all, how important are exclusive collectable toys to a TOY COLLECTORS CONVENTION!

I also noticed that the artlcle on TFCon got deleted recently, and it had a lot of cited media coverage.

What, you think all articles on collectors' conventions need a list of every single toy it's ever released?


For completeness sake, it would be nice.

It's not like we're talking about a ginormous toy line consisting of thousands of entries; I think it would be more than reasonable to have a list of all the toys that a convention known for having exclusive toys has released.


I think it would make sense since these toys are part of the convention itself! When you order your tickets you also order the exclusives as pack of a package. It's not like they are just toys that happen to come out at Botcon time, they are part of the convention admission!

What I find amazing is that someone worries so much about letting there be something they don't want in a simple article, that they fight so hard to keep it out. Do these people have trouble sleeping at night being worried that there might be a few extra sentences in the Botcon article about the toys?

Edited by mignash, 11 January 2011 - 02:17 PM.


#249 NotVeryKnightly

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 02:19 PM

QUOTE(mignash @ Jan 12 2011, 03:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Your quote from the tfwiki "big-time deletion campaign." Not a campaign to correct, improve, add sources to, or clean up the articles. A campaign to delete them!

So except for the precise wording everything is true?

That, and how you seem to think all the deletion is my fault. The people on WP were already sick of the terrible articles that nobody does anything about. Sure I started getting rid of articles in large numbers, but other people already wanted to do something. I just reminded them they can/should. Also, with "campaign", I think I was describing the Claritas socks back when they still looked like different people. I said such a thing (something I couldn't find the right word to describe and decided on "campain" at some point) was going on, I didn't say I was behind it.

#250 G.B.Blackrock

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 02:21 PM

QUOTE(-Blackout- @ Jan 11 2011, 09:43 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
http://en.wikipedia....et_the_point.22

It may be a Wikipedia "behavioural guideline", but some people here would probably benefit from reading it.

Having read the guideline, I could honestly make that accusation of both sides here....

#251 NightViper

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 02:31 PM

QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 02:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Sure I started getting rid of articles in large numbers


QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 02:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I just reminded them they can/should.


QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 02:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I didn't say I was behind it.


So you started it, told others that they should do it too...but since you're not the only one that deleted articles, you're not the one "behind it" all?

#252 NotVeryKnightly

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 02:37 PM

QUOTE(NightViper @ Jan 12 2011, 03:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 02:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Sure I started getting rid of articles in large numbers


QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 02:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I just reminded them they can/should.


QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 02:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I didn't say I was behind it.


So you started it, told others that they should do it too...but since you're not the only one that deleted articles, you're not the one "behind it" all?

Well, it seems like people already thought of doing it, perhaps they got the idea from me, but I never told them to.

#253 (Deactivated) mignash

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 02:40 PM

If you want to be helpful, try spending as much time researching citations and adding good content as you do trying to get articles deleted. I'm ordering book and magazines on ebay and at the library to get citations for articles that you delete before the book arrives!

#254 Professor

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 02:45 PM

It's pretty obvious that efforts like this aren't really done by people trying to improve wikipedia. There's a lot to be said for correcting, limiting, or containing articles, but outright removing information that could be clearly and succinctly presented is clearly contrary to wiki's overall principles. In this case, there are an awful lot of smaller and less significant organizations listed in wiki, and pursuing the Timelines brand in this way clearly isn't an efficient way to make wiki better.

So, the real question is, what are people who do this trying to do. What's in it for them? I suppose the easy analysis is that it's just a power trip from internet dwellers craving some sense of authority, but I really doubt it's so simple. People don't target information for eradication randomly like that. I think it's pretty likely that this started somewhere with a po'd TF fan, who decided to use wiki to pursue a personal agenda, and everything just fell out from that.

My point is, while I suppose the wiki community can be blamed for having easily manipulated or bandwagon-y elements, I suspect the Transformers community created this problem itself. I don't think we get to be holier-than-thou to wikipedia on this, because it's probably one of our own crazies who started it.

#255 NotVeryKnightly

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 02:47 PM

QUOTE(mignash @ Jan 12 2011, 03:40 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
If you want to be helpful, try spending as much time researching citations and adding good content as you do trying to get articles deleted. I'm ordering book and magazines on ebay and at the library to get citations for articles that you delete before the book arrives!

Which one did I "delete before the book arrives"? The Timelines page was deleted minutes after you mentioned a magazine, and it said preview, which is probably part of the reason people aren't convinced that it's gonna be enough. (Some time earlier on, somebody mentioned that previews are not really extensive coverage that gets an article kept).

#256 (Deactivated) mignash

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 03:04 PM

QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 02:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(mignash @ Jan 12 2011, 03:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Your quote from the tfwiki "big-time deletion campaign." Not a campaign to correct, improve, add sources to, or clean up the articles. A campaign to delete them!

So except for the precise wording everything is true?

That, and how you seem to think all the deletion is my fault. The people on WP were already sick of the terrible articles that nobody does anything about. Sure I started getting rid of articles in large numbers, but other people already wanted to do something. I just reminded them they can/should. Also, with "campaign", I think I was describing the Claritas socks back when they still looked like different people. I said such a thing (something I couldn't find the right word to describe and decided on "campain" at some point) was going on, I didn't say I was behind it.


So there were other people nominating articles for deletion en mass without trying to improve them... you joined in. Then it was discovered that most of those others were sock puppeteers whose intention was to disrupt and sabotage Wikipedia while pissing everone off... and so you decided the best course of action was to CONTINUE to do the same thing you did before.

BTW - A preview of a toy in a magazine is just a review before the toy is released. Considering the magazine STILL hasn't arrived, I can't argue the point, but thanks to your efforts everyone on Wikipedia is so sick of debating Timelines, I don't dare ask for another deletion review.

Edited by mignash, 11 January 2011 - 03:08 PM.


#257 NotVeryKnightly

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 03:08 PM

QUOTE(mignash @ Jan 12 2011, 04:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So there were other people nominating articles for deletion en mass without trying to improve them... you joined in. Then it was discovered that those others were sock puppeteers whose intention was to disrupt and sabotage Wikipedia while pissing everone off... and so you decided the best course of action was to CONTINUE to do the same thing.

Not really. As pointed out on WP, just because a sock puppet suggested somethin doesn't mean it's wrong. The socks get banned, but people can make up their mind about what's right.

QUOTE(Professor @ Jan 12 2011, 03:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It's pretty obvious that efforts like this aren't really done by people trying to improve wikipedia. There's a lot to be said for correcting, limiting, or containing articles, but outright removing information that could be clearly and succinctly presented is clearly contrary to wiki's overall principles. In this case, there are an awful lot of smaller and less significant organizations listed in wiki, and pursuing the Timelines brand in this way clearly isn't an efficient way to make wiki better.

So, the real question is, what are people who do this trying to do. What's in it for them? I suppose the easy analysis is that it's just a power trip from internet dwellers craving some sense of authority, but I really doubt it's so simple. People don't target information for eradication randomly like that. I think it's pretty likely that this started somewhere with a po'd TF fan, who decided to use wiki to pursue a personal agenda, and everything just fell out from that.

My point is, while I suppose the wiki community can be blamed for having easily manipulated or bandwagon-y elements, I suspect the Transformers community created this problem itself. I don't think we get to be holier-than-thou to wikipedia on this, because it's probably one of our own crazies who started it.

Hmmm, if by "the Transformers community created this problem itself", do you mean that they written terrible articles that shouldn't stand a chance for a ood number of reasons and then never did anything to fix it until some people get pissed of and start getting rid of the articles?
I think the people deletin this are trying to improve WP, the whole "just because it's true doesn't mean belongs here" thing is the best justification I find for their notability rule. Plus, a lot of the articles are just really, really bad. It's at least improving like "expelling the struggling students to improve a school's average performance". Although unlike students, articles are not living people. I think here has some answers. Perhaps some things I did had seemed like campaigning, but I stopped those things. And, unlike what Mignash has continually said, I never used that description on myself. He could have pointed out that somethin was wrong with that, but he kept commentin on something I didn't do, and only pointed out what I most definitely did wrong there like months ago (the link there should show that).

Edited by Item42, 11 January 2011 - 03:10 PM.


#258 ▲ndrusi

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 03:17 PM

QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 03:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It's at least improving like "expelling the struggling students to improve a school's average performance".

Do you hate agreement? Is that what's going on here? Do you just hate having people agree with you?

#259 NotVeryKnightly

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 03:19 PM

QUOTE(▲ndrusi @ Jan 12 2011, 04:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 03:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It's at least improving like "expelling the struggling students to improve a school's average performance".

Do you hate agreement? Is that what's going on here? Do you just hate having people agree with you?

I'm not really sure anymore about who's agreeing with what.

Edited by Item42, 11 January 2011 - 03:20 PM.


#260 ▲ndrusi

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 03:41 PM

QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 03:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(▲ndrusi @ Jan 12 2011, 04:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Item42 @ Jan 11 2011, 03:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It's at least improving like "expelling the struggling students to improve a school's average performance".

Do you hate agreement? Is that what's going on here? Do you just hate having people agree with you?

I'm not really sure anymore about who's agreeing with what.

"Expelling the struggling students to improve a school's average performance" is a textbook example of manufacturing superficial improvement while not actually improving anything. If you're arguing that people are really trying to improve Wikipedia by nominating articles for deletion, then that's a terrible analogy to use.

Edited by ▲ndrusi, 11 January 2011 - 03:43 PM.