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@  Benbot : (20 November 2018 - 06:54 PM)

We're not actually back, this is all a dream.

@  TheMightyMol... : (20 November 2018 - 06:12 PM)

It was, we're just humoring you.

@  Arazyr : (20 November 2018 - 02:17 PM)

I was wondering if that was just me...

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (20 November 2018 - 02:01 PM)

And we are back after that round of Forum downtime.

@  Pennpenn : (20 November 2018 - 06:30 AM)

Feels like it's been so long since there's been a proper storm that I've been awake for. This one even has pink lightning, which always great.

@  Pennpenn : (20 November 2018 - 06:22 AM)

So long as he has an R by his name. Even if the R is for "Recepticons"

@  Nevermore : (20 November 2018 - 06:18 AM)

Sadly, my first reaction was "And I'm sure way too many people would seriously, unironically really vote for the blatant bad guy and still cheer at him while he's slaughtering the masses because they saw him on TV and he's cool."

@  Nevermore : (20 November 2018 - 06:17 AM)

Someone over at TFW2005 just discovered an old photo of political campaign signs, with one saying "Vote Megatron! Global Domination."

@  Paladin : (19 November 2018 - 07:02 AM)

let's be real. at this rate we're not lasting until 2075.

@  Maximus Ambus : (19 November 2018 - 06:34 AM)

The rest of the world may build a wall around the US in 2075.

@  Nevermore : (19 November 2018 - 05:53 AM)

Tell an conservative conspiracy maniac that women are literally the Satan's spawn out to infect humanity with the gender virus that will turn everyone into communist Muslims who eat children, and they will be like, "Well of course! That makes perfect sense!"

@  Nevermore : (19 November 2018 - 05:49 AM)

It's evidence of Poe's Law.

@  Nevermore : (19 November 2018 - 05:48 AM)

The world is insane.

@  Nevermore : (19 November 2018 - 05:48 AM)

Geeez, I just read a story about a liberal satire Facebook page that would publish absolutely outlandish, ridiculous made-up conservative propaganda, stuff so absurd nobody with half a brain could take it seriously... and conservatives are taking it at face value.

@  Pennpenn : (19 November 2018 - 02:27 AM)

Oh don't make me go talk to Peter Dutton. My week has been painful enough as it is...

@  Telly : (18 November 2018 - 09:13 PM)

he cant leave quarantine until he talks to the king of the potato people

@  Pennpenn : (18 November 2018 - 01:03 AM)

Debateable. It's a sunday anyway. Wonder if I'll still feel up and ready to go tomorrow. Don't want to take too many days off leading up to the end of the year.

@  MEDdMI : (18 November 2018 - 12:01 AM)

@Pennpenn hooray! Now you can leave quarantine.

@  RichardT1977 : (17 November 2018 - 08:58 PM)

The national tour is currently in Raleigh-Durham.

@  Pennpenn : (17 November 2018 - 06:29 PM)

Ok, feeling much better now.

@  wonko the sane? : (17 November 2018 - 06:20 PM)

Is hamilton playing in hamilton?

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (17 November 2018 - 03:34 PM)

Maybe the show in the city?

@  wonko the sane? : (17 November 2018 - 01:21 PM)

To the show or the city?

@  The Doctor Who : (17 November 2018 - 11:01 AM)

Niiice!

@  RichardT1977 : (17 November 2018 - 10:48 AM)

My mom won two tickets to Hamilton!

@  wonko the sane? : (17 November 2018 - 09:46 AM)

Welp, good morning so far. My brother helped me get my sister in law's christmas gift, and reminded me I still had to get my mom's calendar for next year.

@  Pennpenn : (17 November 2018 - 08:22 AM)

Oh yeah, feeling feverish. What fun.

@  wonko the sane? : (16 November 2018 - 10:07 PM)

My father used to ask his boss that question. Then he STOPPED asking, and got used to twiddling his thumbs. Made things so much easier, and didn't actually change how his bosses thought of him.

@  Nevermore : (16 November 2018 - 07:31 PM)

So of course you wait until the end of your shift like everyone else, THEN you walk up to the manager on duty and ask him what you're supposed to do during the requested overtime.

@  Nevermore : (16 November 2018 - 07:30 PM)

Fun: The employer allows (paid) voluntary overtime, cannot backtrack on the permit, and before the regular end of your shift, you notice you're rapidly running out of work.

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (16 November 2018 - 06:27 PM)

Fear is a state of mind.

@  TheMightyMol... : (16 November 2018 - 06:25 PM)

Did you just assume my sociopolitical status?

@  Pennpenn : (16 November 2018 - 06:13 PM)

Oh stop being such a pack of drama monarchs!

@  TheMightyMol... : (16 November 2018 - 06:11 PM)

Too late. They can smell your fear.

@  Maximus Ambus : (16 November 2018 - 04:10 PM)

Nobody say anything and you'll be safe from the mob.

@  TM2-Megatron : (16 November 2018 - 03:41 PM)

It used to be

@  Arazyr : (16 November 2018 - 02:05 PM)

I would agree.

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (16 November 2018 - 01:15 PM)

I say yes, but I imagine many would disagree with me.

@  Paladin : (16 November 2018 - 12:34 PM)

settle a bet: is "drama queen" a gender-neutral description?

@  TM2-Megatron : (15 November 2018 - 08:38 PM)

Sounds like management is the same everywhere :p

@  TheMightyMol... : (15 November 2018 - 08:12 PM)

My bosses are too busy trying to see if they can have their heads up their own asses while still being able to kiss the asses of everyone above them. It'd be amusing to watch if I wasn't one of the ones trying to get everything done to cover for it.

@  Nevermore : (15 November 2018 - 07:05 PM)

He's living by the standard "bow to those below you; kick at those above you. You got more people below you than above you."

@  Nevermore : (15 November 2018 - 07:04 PM)

Whenever we go on strike, he's there with us. He told me that this is the only completely legal way for him to show his own bosses the finger,

@  Nevermore : (15 November 2018 - 07:03 PM)

Well, this guy has been getting flak from above, it's just that he doesn't care. He's doing what he thinks is right. He's easily the smartest of my superiors, and also the one with the biggest balls.

@  TheMightyMol... : (15 November 2018 - 05:24 PM)

Must be nice, having a boss that cares.

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (15 November 2018 - 01:03 PM)

Indeed.

@  Echowarrior : (15 November 2018 - 11:58 AM)

That's a good superior.

@  Nevermore : (15 November 2018 - 06:21 AM)

Arguing in my favor that I was working under sub-par conditions, there were problems with sudden halts of the conveyor and other issues that affected my productivity, and besides, why was this guy giving a feedback to one of HIS subordinates, wich was his job?

@  Nevermore : (15 November 2018 - 06:19 AM)

Also, yesterday he stood up for me when a superior from the department I was sent to was giving me a productivity feedback.

@  Nevermore : (15 November 2018 - 06:19 AM)

So this week all of my superiors save one guy are absent, and I'm not noticing a difference. Which says a lot about this guy.


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Optimus Prime #23 Discussion


23 replies to this topic

#1 Jalaguy

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Posted 04 September 2018 - 05:19 PM

Discuss the issue here!

#2 Locoman

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 07:30 AM

Are the little gazelle creatures in Gimlet's flashback also supposed to be sentient, do you think?
"He learned, almost too late, that man is a feeling creature and, because of it, the greatest in the universe. He learned, too late for himself, that men have to make their own way, to make their own mistakes. There can't be any gift of perfection from outside ourselves. And, when men seek such perfection, they find there's only death, fire, loss, disillusionment, the end of everything that's gone forward. Men have always sought an end to toil and misery. It can't be given; it has to be achieved. There is hope, but it has to come from inside, from man himself."

#3 Devcon

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 07:45 AM

This issue implies that Jazz was the one who sent for Optimus to come to earth.... wasnt that Ironhide in Infiltration 3?
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#4 Jalaguy

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 07:53 AM

This issue implies that Jazz was the one who sent for Optimus to come to earth.... wasnt that Ironhide in Infiltration 3?


Jazz was sent to Earth as a scout, ahead of the rest of the infiltration unit. It was established in OP #8 and his Sourcebook profile, IIRC.

#5 Wildwade

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 08:07 AM

 

This issue implies that Jazz was the one who sent for Optimus to come to earth.... wasnt that Ironhide in Infiltration 3?


Jazz was sent to Earth as a scout, ahead of the rest of the infiltration unit. It was established in OP #8 and his Sourcebook profile, IIRC.

 

 

I think that came from an off-handed comment from Costa's run too, which again shows what kind of insane attention to detail Barber has.

 

I liked this, despite not really caring overmuch about the colonist recruits.  Mainframe and Gimlet's deaths were given the appropriate weight and I enjoyed the backstory of some of the colonies.



#6 Broadside

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 08:17 AM

Gotta be honest... I wasn't too fond of this one. On top of hating "can you all just calm down and talk to each other" plots, the cutesy Prips visuals really didn't mesh with how bleak the story was.


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#7 Prime Radiant

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 11:10 AM

Wow, an issue where the main characters were flashbacks.


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#8 Jetstreamx

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 01:06 PM

This issue implies that Jazz was the one who sent for Optimus to come to earth.... wasnt that Ironhide in Infiltration 3?

Ironhide sent Optimus a priority pulse wave, as shown in Infiltration 3 and Stormbringer 1 informing him that the Decepticons were entering Siege Mode. It's not revealed that Ironhide actually requested him to come to Earth in that, so there was plenty of wiggle room.

 

Anyway, I didn't care for this issue very much. I'm not terribly fond of how the flashbacks were incorporated and Slide is just a black hole that sucks all the joy out of the comic any time she's in it. Having a comic that featured him prominently was not fun.

 

I also felt like this issue was trying to directly equivocate the colonization of Devisiun with what's happening on Earth and I just don't see it. Sure, Optimus Prime erected a city and it's considered sovereign Cybertronian land, but like, it's no more colonizing Earth in this sense than an embassy is colonizing another country. I think the exploration of Optimus being totalitarian and expansionist is cool and all, but it would probably work better if Optimus ACTUALLY seemed expansionist and totalitarian rather than abusing his power to prevent other people from being expansionist and totalitarian. :/

 

I'm re-reading IDW's run as this continuity ends, so maybe this might make more sense to me when I'm able to read it in a few sittings rather than month by month.


Edited by Jetstreamx, 06 September 2018 - 10:26 AM.


#9 Broadside

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 01:57 PM

Anyway, I didn't care for this issue very much. I'm not terribly fond of how the flashbacks were incorporated and Oiler is just a black hole that sucks all the joy out of the comic any time he's in it. Having a comic that featured him prominently was not fun.

 

Slide. She.


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#10 DocChloroplast

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 02:04 PM

 

This issue implies that Jazz was the one who sent for Optimus to come to earth.... wasnt that Ironhide in Infiltration 3?

Ironhide sent Optimus a priority pulse wave, as shown in Infiltration 3 and Stormbringer 1 informing him that the Decepticons were entering Siege Mode. It's not revealed that Ironhide actually requested him to come to Earth in that, so there was plenty of wiggle room.

 

Anyway, I didn't care for this issue very much. I'm not terribly fond of how the flashbacks were incorporated and Oiler is just a black hole that sucks all the joy out of the comic any time he's in it. Having a comic that featured him prominently was not fun.

 

I also felt like this issue was trying to directly equivocate the colonization of Devisiun with what's happening on Earth and I just don't see it. Sure, Optimus Prime erected a city and it's considered sovereign Cybertronian land, but like, it's no more colonizing Earth in this sense than an embassy is colonizing another country. I think the exploration of Optimus being totalitarian and expansionist is cool and all, but it would probably work better if Optimus ACTUALLY seemed expansionist and totalitarian rather than abusing his power to prevent other people from being expansionist and totalitarian. :/

 

I'm re-reading IDW's run as this continuity ends, so maybe this might make more sense to me when I'm able to read it in a few sittings rather than month by month.

 

 

But Prime didn't just establish Metrotitan as an embassy. He EXPLICITLY said "I hereby annex Earth into the Cybertronian Council of Worlds," a completely unilateral decision that left out not ONLY the ruling council of Cybertron and its new confederacy (or whatever Starscream was calling it at the time) but ALSO every single person on Earth. It doesn't matter how we see it, from the outside and with all of Prime's misguided motivations for doing it; from the perspective of humanity, it's practically the equivalent of one Earth nation claiming sovereignty over another.


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#11 Locoman

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 02:08 PM

I also felt like this issue was trying to directly equivocate the colonization of Devisiun with what's happening on Earth and I just don't see it. Sure, Optimus Prime erected a city and it's considered sovereign Cybertronian land, but like, it's no more colonizing Earth in this sense than an embassy is colonizing another country. I think the exploration of Optimus being totalitarian and expansionist is cool and all, but it would probably work better if Optimus ACTUALLY seemed expansionist and totalitarian rather than abusing his power to prevent other people from being expansionist and totalitarian. :/
 
I'm re-reading IDW's run as this continuity ends, so maybe this might make more sense to me when I'm able to read it in a few sittings rather than month by month.


I took it as the opposite - Slide and Oiler joined up with Optimus because they WANTED to colonize Earth in the same way that their ancestors colonized Devisiun, and she's mad at him because he's working with the natives, rather than just paving over their cities and sending them to reservations to be played with like pets.
"He learned, almost too late, that man is a feeling creature and, because of it, the greatest in the universe. He learned, too late for himself, that men have to make their own way, to make their own mistakes. There can't be any gift of perfection from outside ourselves. And, when men seek such perfection, they find there's only death, fire, loss, disillusionment, the end of everything that's gone forward. Men have always sought an end to toil and misery. It can't be given; it has to be achieved. There is hope, but it has to come from inside, from man himself."

#12 Jetstreamx

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 02:17 PM

 

 

This issue implies that Jazz was the one who sent for Optimus to come to earth.... wasnt that Ironhide in Infiltration 3?

Ironhide sent Optimus a priority pulse wave, as shown in Infiltration 3 and Stormbringer 1 informing him that the Decepticons were entering Siege Mode. It's not revealed that Ironhide actually requested him to come to Earth in that, so there was plenty of wiggle room.

 

Anyway, I didn't care for this issue very much. I'm not terribly fond of how the flashbacks were incorporated and Oiler is just a black hole that sucks all the joy out of the comic any time he's in it. Having a comic that featured him prominently was not fun.

 

I also felt like this issue was trying to directly equivocate the colonization of Devisiun with what's happening on Earth and I just don't see it. Sure, Optimus Prime erected a city and it's considered sovereign Cybertronian land, but like, it's no more colonizing Earth in this sense than an embassy is colonizing another country. I think the exploration of Optimus being totalitarian and expansionist is cool and all, but it would probably work better if Optimus ACTUALLY seemed expansionist and totalitarian rather than abusing his power to prevent other people from being expansionist and totalitarian. :/

 

I'm re-reading IDW's run as this continuity ends, so maybe this might make more sense to me when I'm able to read it in a few sittings rather than month by month.

 

 

But Prime didn't just establish Metrotitan as an embassy. He EXPLICITLY said "I hereby annex Earth into the Cybertronian Council of Worlds," a completely unilateral decision that left out not ONLY the ruling council of Cybertron and its new confederacy (or whatever Starscream was calling it at the time) but ALSO every single person on Earth. It doesn't matter how we see it, from the outside and with all of Prime's misguided motivations for doing it; from the perspective of humanity, it's practically the equivalent of one Earth nation claiming sovereignty over another.

 

 

The issue I have is less how others in story see it and more that this issue directly treats the colonization of Divisiun and the annexation of Earth as roughly equivalent. They're not.



#13 Primer Prime

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 02:48 PM

Even if the book weren't being rushed to conclusion this issue would feel like a waste.

 

Slag here seems to explicitly recall being Slag... but isn't he a new spark in Slag's body? Er, Slug's. 



#14 Magnusblitz

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 03:24 PM

There's some interesting backstory here about Devisiun, especially the difference in portrayal between the natives as they tell their story and Slide's telling of it (including a happy native driving the truck?) but the actual story occurring feels incredibly inconsequential. The art was also really bad... I'm not a fan of Tramontano's art in general but this was rough even for her. I wonder if this was rushed or a late fill-in or something.



#15 Locoman

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 03:36 PM

Going by how the nature in that scene seems fairly well-kept and clean, as opposed to the sickly, partially cyberformed landscape on the first page, I'd guess it was some kind of park or nature reserve, and (if we're taking the colonialism metaphor all the way) perhaps the Transformers just come to gawk and condescendingly interact with the natives that live there.
"He learned, almost too late, that man is a feeling creature and, because of it, the greatest in the universe. He learned, too late for himself, that men have to make their own way, to make their own mistakes. There can't be any gift of perfection from outside ourselves. And, when men seek such perfection, they find there's only death, fire, loss, disillusionment, the end of everything that's gone forward. Men have always sought an end to toil and misery. It can't be given; it has to be achieved. There is hope, but it has to come from inside, from man himself."

#16 Sockie

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 03:42 PM

Even if the book weren't being rushed to conclusion this issue would feel like a waste.

 

Slag here seems to explicitly recall being Slag... but isn't he a new spark in Slag's body? Er, Slug's. 

 

Slug's brain module was still intact, so his memories were just put into the new spark, I believe. Last issue indicated they did something similar with Optimus and Bumblebee.



#17 DocChloroplast

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 04:43 PM

It's like Wheeljack said... just don't worry about it. Rossum's trinity works in ways to make the plot convenient :p


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#18 Creedence

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 05:34 PM

Out of the three today, this was the most dull. Art was out of sync with the tone and I just cannot care about the Earth colonists.

#19 Daniel Adkins

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Posted 05 September 2018 - 09:04 PM

 


I took it as the opposite - Slide and Oiler joined up with Optimus because they WANTED to colonize Earth in the same way that their ancestors colonized Devisiun, and she's mad at him because he's working with the natives, rather than just paving over their cities and sending them to reservations to be played with like pets.

 

Not necessarily. Slide's primary beef with Optimus is that she feels he's working with the "enemy." In her mind, because the Junkions killed Oiler, they should have defeated them in retribution. Instead, Optimus settled things peacefully and gave the Junkions a home. She sees humans the same way, especially given the recent stuff with Jazz.

 

Slide obviously has a very skewed, colonialist attitude towards Cybertronian history, but less "let's take over this world and keep the humans as pets" and more "they wronged us, so we should fight back!" In a way, she's a mirror of Aileron, who very much started out as that same archetype, but ended up growing in a different way that saw her learning to understand other sides and work with others, while Slide is letting her anger consume her.



#20 Jetstreamx

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Posted 06 September 2018 - 03:18 AM

 

Anyway, I didn't care for this issue very much. I'm not terribly fond of how the flashbacks were incorporated and Oiler is just a black hole that sucks all the joy out of the comic any time he's in it. Having a comic that featured him prominently was not fun.

 

Slide. She.

 

How did I not notice this entire time? Thank you!


Edited by Jetstreamx, 06 September 2018 - 03:33 AM.




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