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@  Cybersnark : (09 December 2018 - 09:36 PM)

But The Pillows prefer to kill you with Poison Rock'N'Roll

@  Rodimus Supreme : (09 December 2018 - 10:23 AM)

Pillows can kill you softly.

@  Pennpenn : (09 December 2018 - 07:26 AM)

His song.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (09 December 2018 - 05:34 AM)

But is anything killing you softly?

@  Pennpenn : (09 December 2018 - 03:03 AM)

Oh don't be ridiculous. Some things are killing us quickly!

@  Rodimus Supreme : (08 December 2018 - 10:46 PM)

Isn't everything just killing us all slowly?...

@  wonko the sane? : (08 December 2018 - 09:23 PM)

Except the planet of junk actually fosters life, as opposed to the garbage patch which is just killing us all slowly.

@  RichardT1977 : (08 December 2018 - 11:11 AM)

I realized the other day that the Planet of Junk/Junkion is the interstellar counterpart to the Great Pacific Garbage Patch.

@  unluckiness : (08 December 2018 - 08:56 AM)

awards are a joke to begin with. One for video games makes it twice so.

@  TheMightyMol... : (08 December 2018 - 03:21 AM)

Sorry, I had beans.

@  Waspinator : (07 December 2018 - 11:50 PM)

The Wheel of Time turns, and Ages come and pass, leaving memories that become legend. Legend fades to myth, and even myth is long forgotten when the Age that gave it birth comes again. In one Age, called the Third Age by some, an Age yet to come, an Age long past, a wind rose in the Mountains of Mist. The wind was not the beginning. There are neither beginnings nor endings to the turning of the Wheel of Time. But it was a beginning.

@  PlutoniumBoss : (07 December 2018 - 10:33 PM)

Always hopeful yet discontent, he knows changes aren't permanent, but change is!

@  Pennpenn : (07 December 2018 - 07:16 PM)

Nonsense. Everything changes, the cycle is an illusion.

@  Waspinator : (07 December 2018 - 07:03 PM)

Turning, turning, turning through the years. Minutes into hours, and the hours into years. Nothing changes, nothing ever can. Round about the roundabout. Round and round and back where you began!

@  Pennpenn : (07 December 2018 - 06:56 PM)

The change was you got something off your wishlist. Be happy about that if nothing else!

@  wonko the sane? : (07 December 2018 - 02:09 PM)

I finally got something off my steam wishlist! but managed to add another title immediately: so there was no change. Dang it.

@  Dekafox : (07 December 2018 - 01:46 PM)

They're the thieves everyone is talking about though!

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (07 December 2018 - 11:06 AM)

Wrong Phantom thieves!

@  Dekafox : (07 December 2018 - 11:04 AM)

I thought they were just trying to take the Lupin Collection pieces

@  MEDdMI : (07 December 2018 - 09:25 AM)

damn you Phantom Thieves and your "Take Your heart wallet" motto!

@  MEDdMI : (07 December 2018 - 09:23 AM)

@Tm_Silverclaw whaaaaa????? :o *sees trailer* AAAAARRGGHHHHHH!!!!!!!!

@  unluckiness : (07 December 2018 - 03:15 AM)

Great, Waspinator got exploded again.

@  Waspinator : (07 December 2018 - 02:39 AM)

Taka, Tora, Batta: Ta-To-Ba! Tatoba, Ta-To-Ba!

@  unluckiness : (07 December 2018 - 12:08 AM)

cyclone

@  Waspinator : (06 December 2018 - 11:39 PM)

that is super weird

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (06 December 2018 - 11:32 PM)

My brain broke!

 

Joker... From Persona 5... In Smash....

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (06 December 2018 - 10:25 PM)

That doesn't suprise me.. I'm more waiting for Rockstar to pull a Bethesda.

@  Steevy Maximus : (06 December 2018 - 09:46 PM)

Red Dead is running wild over the Game Awards. More than a few have been awarded where I don't feel they should have won.

@  Steevy Maximus : (06 December 2018 - 09:11 PM)

Marvel Ultimate Allience 3 Switch Exclusive for 2019!?

@  unluckiness : (06 December 2018 - 08:57 AM)

The red plastic holding it together kinda worries me. It's the gummi kind of clear plasstic andmoving it feels uncpomfortably close to tearing.

@  Shrug : (06 December 2018 - 08:17 AM)

Yeah, that happened to mine a few weeks ago. Common problem.

@  Pennpenn : (06 December 2018 - 08:05 AM)

Oh for cryin' out loud, the yellow part on the back hinge of my TR Weirdwolf broke. Bleh. At least the red is still there I guess.

@  unluckiness : (06 December 2018 - 04:59 AM)

Man, I still haven't gotten past Rock Tunnel.

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (06 December 2018 - 03:28 AM)

You know nothing.. NOTHING! Eevee is our lord and savior! He will give us the cuteness we need! ;) No seriously.. Both Pika and Eevee in the games are way OP and Eevee can learn elemental moves to replace evolving.

@  TheMightyMol... : (06 December 2018 - 03:22 AM)

It's cute, what other point does it need?

@  Pennpenn : (06 December 2018 - 03:17 AM)

I can get Pikachu not evolving, the species has had decades of not evolving. But Eevee without evolution seems... pointless?

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (06 December 2018 - 03:15 AM)

Neither can Pikachu... And you don't need Eevee to evolve!

@  TheMightyMol... : (06 December 2018 - 03:15 AM)

Neither of them can evolve as starters.

@  Pennpenn : (06 December 2018 - 02:30 AM)

Also damn it my mouse wheel broke. What a pisser.

@  Pennpenn : (06 December 2018 - 02:30 AM)

It can't evolve.

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (06 December 2018 - 02:29 AM)

How dare you! You KNOW Eevee is the obvious choice!

@  wonko the sane? : (05 December 2018 - 05:48 PM)

Finished mine a few days ago, and just bought myself (I really shouldn't have, but did anyway.) let's go pikachu with the pokeball.

@  Cybersnark : (05 December 2018 - 03:47 PM)

Mostly. There's a book en route to my mom's house from the UK and I don't know if it'll arrive before January.

@  Cybersnark : (05 December 2018 - 03:46 PM)

Christmas shopping: complete.

@  RichardT1977 : (05 December 2018 - 12:37 PM)

(which would lead to a bunch of bad jokes about him selling a line of cashews, almonds, and pecans)

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (05 December 2018 - 12:37 PM)

That would make sense per the precedent of Kamen Rider OOO ("Kamen Raidā Ōzu").

@  RichardT1977 : (05 December 2018 - 12:35 PM)

Wouldn't it be pronounced "Kamen Rider D's"?

@  fourteenwings : (05 December 2018 - 11:37 AM)

Kamen Rider Dream Drop Distance?

@  Sabrblade : (05 December 2018 - 09:57 AM)

Kamen Rider DDD, or "3D" as it would be pronounced.

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (05 December 2018 - 06:50 AM)

Dedede is secretly a Kamen Rider? You know what? Why not. I honestly wouldn't be suprised!


Photo
- - - - -

Part of Back to the Future 2 bothers me...


46 replies to this topic

#1 Telly

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 02:54 PM

i highly doubt this is a new thought (especially given how sharp the people here are), but its been bugging me for some time.

 

so at the beginning, doc comes to marty and jennifer and tells them they have to do something about their kids in the future. no problem there. so they hop in the delorean and set course for 2015. THIS is where it starts bugging me. how can marty and jennifer help their kids if they (marty and jen) have essentially been removed from the timeline?

 

im hardly a genius when it comes to this stuff, but seems to me that when they leave in the delorean, they no longer exist in the timeline. since theyre moving through the two years, they dont exist between 1985 and 2015. how can they still have kids if they werent around in the preceeding 30 years? is the 2015 they go to an parallel universe?

 

i hope i did a good enough job of explaining what im getting at, cause im not always very good at getting out whats in my head

 

thoughts on this?


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#2 Shadewing

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 03:28 PM

My explination, is simple. They don't disappear because they're still there. What I mean is, while they disappear from the timeline, they return at about the same point they left. That return is factored into the timeline. The timeline only changes when they make actual changes in their own personal timeline, like how the 'You're Fired' fax doesn't disappear til Marty doesn't race Needles. As long as you return to the point you leave, it doesn't matter that you left.

 

As another sort of example, in Doctor Who (which I know would technically follow different rules) the 11th Doctor brings Rory and Amy to a relatively close year (like 10-ish years) and in it they see their future selves actually visiting the area, becuase at that point they were fated to return to their normal lives in their normal timeline. Its not until something changes that that that future becomes invalidated. But at that point time still seemed to move forward with the idea that they'd be able to be at that future place when it was their present.


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#3 Nutjob R/T

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 03:31 PM

... I need to find that image that shows there's like nine timelines in the series and how they get obliterated one after the other
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#4 Aberration

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 03:48 PM

There was an episode of M.A.N.T.I.S. (an old one-season superhero show on Fox) that pretty much did what you're saying. The main hero got thrown into the future, and the whole world sucked because he was declared dead from the moment he left and wasn't there to stop something horrible.

But yeah, it seems like Time always takes it for granted that time travelers will come back to when they're supposed to be.

#5 Steevy Maximus

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 03:59 PM

I was going to say something about the possibility of there being TWO sets of Doc and Martys in the corrupted 1985 (with the "proper" Doc and Marty possibly having never met and Doc not being able to build a time machine), then I realized it could be a delayed erasure, like what occurred in the first film.

 

So, coming from 2015, they might have actually bought themselves extra time to fix the time line.  It was days before Marty noticed the timeline changes in the picture, so I'm assuming the "proper" duo had at least a couple days before the new reality "caught up" with them.



#6 Nutjob R/T

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 04:14 PM

Okay I was wrong, there's just eight.

Picture-12.png

Edited by Nutjob R/T, 06 August 2018 - 04:14 PM.

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#7 Telly

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 04:46 PM

There was an episode of M.A.N.T.I.S. (an old one-season superhero show on Fox) that pretty much did what you're saying. The main hero got thrown into the future, and the whole world sucked because he was declared dead from the moment he left and wasn't there to stop something horrible.

But yeah, it seems like Time always takes it for granted that time travelers will come back to when they're supposed to be.

 

i think the 90s flash show did something similar too

 

as for the picture nutjob posted...

 

 

i knew posting topic this would just lead to me being confused even more!


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#8 Thylacine 2000

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 05:21 PM

Okay I was wrong, there's just eight.

Picture-12.png

"Deux-Loreans" is wrong. Gasoline decays and damages engine parts if it's left sitting in the tank for even 6 months, let alone 70 years. 1885 Doc would have drained the tank before burying it.

It's possible to convert coal to gas, and a man who could invent what was apparently a stove-powered icemaker in 1885 should have been able to do it. We must assume that Doc lacked the parts necessary within their one week deadline.

Edited by Thylacine 2000, 06 August 2018 - 05:25 PM.


#9 Superomegaprime

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 05:21 PM

Time travel, its enough to give one a headache as you try to think about the various consquences of it


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#10 Waspinator

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 06:14 PM

 

There was an episode of M.A.N.T.I.S. (an old one-season superhero show on Fox) that pretty much did what you're saying. The main hero got thrown into the future, and the whole world sucked because he was declared dead from the moment he left and wasn't there to stop something horrible.

But yeah, it seems like Time always takes it for granted that time travelers will come back to when they're supposed to be.

 

i think the 90s flash show did something similar too

 

as for the picture nutjob posted...

 

 

i knew posting topic this would just lead to me being confused even more!

 

That episode is insane. If I recall correctly, O'Brien goes to the future, meets himself, dies, and then his future self goes back to the present. O'Brien for the rest of the show is technically a time clone from alternate timeline.



#11 Telly

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 06:35 PM

that is correct. the miles that ends the series isnt the same one that started it. its only a few hours difference between the 2, but still

 

i think voyager also did sort of the same thing with harry kim


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#12 Creature SH

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 07:23 PM

The part about BTTF 2 that bothers me is the one that came true.


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#13 videomaster21XX

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 09:12 PM

Funny enough, if you watch some of the bonus features on the trilogy sets. (I have the one that first included the Ride footage) they address this.

 

Basically yeah, they state that the way it works is off the knowledge that at some point Marty and Jenifer go back to the timeline. Or the 'real' answer. If it worked with Marty and Jenifer vanishing from the timeline, they couldn't do the movie, so that didn't happen.


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#14 Benbot

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 09:57 PM

This is one thing Voyager actually got right with the invention of timeships.  They are able to "integrate" multiple versions of the same person into a single entity in the timeline.  No need to explain it further than that.  Past, present and future selves are all the same individual--there is no right or wrong version--they're all native to the same timeline.



#15 The Doctor Who

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 10:26 PM

I am obligated:

 

 

More to the point:

The Back to the Future movies seem to roughly follow the rule that timelines take a certain amount of time to catch up and that individuals involved in time travel are somehow specially protected from the events, at least to a certain degree.  So Marty, Doc and co can jump around in time and there seems to be a general 'assumption' of sorts by the timeline that they return and everything's normal, right up until something that might change it happens and then it seems to take a dramatically valuable period of time to adjust.


Edited by The Doctor Who, 06 August 2018 - 10:29 PM.

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#16 Pocket

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Posted 06 August 2018 - 11:45 PM

How long did Marty spend in 1955 before his photo started fading out? Like a week? It would probably have taken the same amount of time for 2015 to start going screwy. And they were only there for about a day. Same reason the effects of Biff's trip didn't start manifesting until they traveled back. (Although that too is a bit confusing. Why didn't the three of them end up back in normal 1985, only to have the entire town slowly change like Marty's family photo over the course of the following week? Could it be explained away by Biff deciding to stick around for an extra week after dropping off the book to take a trip down Memory Lane?)

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#17 Telly

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Posted 07 August 2018 - 08:05 AM

 

i have a shirt with that on it :)

 

How long did Marty spend in 1955 before his photo started fading out? Like a week? It would probably have taken the same amount of time for 2015 to start going screwy. And they were only there for about a day. Same reason the effects of Biff's trip didn't start manifesting until they traveled back. (Although that too is a bit confusing. Why didn't the three of them end up back in normal 1985, only to have the entire town slowly change like Marty's family photo over the course of the following week?

 

best guess is past changes are near instantaneous (well, from a certain point of view). since times normal motion is forward, anything changed in the past has ample opportunity to set in and take affect. its kinda hard to imagine as most stories dont have more than one person running around changing time in opposite directions. its usually a person (or in this case a team of people) working to change ONE thing then heading home. hardly ever see someone from said time stealing the groups time machine and going back to change something else. so i think this is a unique situation in time travel stories

 

back on point, i think doc is completely right with his explanation of why they didnt come back to the "normal" 1985. the timeline had 30 years (starting from 1955) to adjust itself and make rich biff set in and be the norm. as for the picture taking a week to fade, marty had until the big dance to get them together cause that was where they had their first kiss. had marty shown up two weeks before the dance or two hours, he wouldve had the corresponding amount of time to get them together; two weeks in the first case, two hours in the second case. and the picture wouldve been faded (or not) to reflect how much time he had. 


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#18 wonko the sane?

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Posted 07 August 2018 - 08:31 AM

The first thing to understand about time travel: no one person, or group of people, is so important that just the presence or lack of presence will affect anything. Unless you travel far enough that your modern germs start a plague... or you go so far forward that you die from a modern disease you have no immunity for.

 

The second thing to understand: if your start and end point of your trip aren't so significantly spaced that your disappearance can't be explained away by something mundane (I.e. You leave at 10 am, and come back at noon. "guys, I just went to walmart.") then you still exist for the time between. Because we as individuals aren't that important. If you bugger off for a couple of years (i.e. you leave at 10 am august 2012 and come back 10 am august 2018.) and make no attempt to repair the gap (cause the only way to fix time travel is with more time travel.) THEN you do not exist for that period. But likely will have changed nothing anyway... cause we as individuals aren't that important. Which is why stuff like BTTF goes out of it's way to make departures and arrivals almost overlap. There's a lot less to fix if no one even notices you left in the first place.

 

You thought JET LAG was bad. Try spend 1 minute and 2 weeks in the future. This is why time travel sucks.

 

Long story short: if someone offers you a cheap and relatively easy way to time travel. Don't do it. It's not worth the real head ache or the existential crisis.



#19 Axaday

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Posted 07 August 2018 - 08:52 AM

How long did Marty spend in 1955 before his photo started fading out? Like a week? It would probably have taken the same amount of time for 2015 to start going screwy. And they were only there for about a day. Same reason the effects of Biff's trip didn't start manifesting until they traveled back. (Although that too is a bit confusing. Why didn't the three of them end up back in normal 1985, only to have the entire town slowly change like Marty's family photo over the course of the following week? Could it be explained away by Biff deciding to stick around for an extra week after dropping off the book to take a trip down Memory Lane?)


We actually dont know if 2015 changed before they left. They were already in a bad neighborhood and Biff got back right before they left. All we saw was a bad neighborhood in the dark.

What bothers ME is the movie not explaining old Biff being in pain. There is some implication, but not enough that I understood it before it was explained to me. In the timeline he created he did not survive to 2015. I think that is very poignant and should have been hammered home.

#20 Nutjob R/T

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Posted 07 August 2018 - 08:55 AM

Ah, see, first flick, Marty was the locus of the timeline disturbance. Apparently it takes time (!?) for disturbances to propagate forward through the timeline, hit Marty's existance and then propagate back to him in the past. Then in the second flick, the time it takes for Old Biff's changes to propagate forward means they left the 2015 of Timeline 3 before the changes hit, but landed in 1985 Timeline 4 after the propagation wave had already passed.
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