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@  Otaku : (23 October 2018 - 09:12 AM)

Now, I'm not saying that Cybertronians ought to have human life-spans, just that "millions of years" is too long.  Though I suppose it makes the "Oh, I suddenly remembered [plot point]!" moments credible because where do you store all the memories in an easily accessed form?  If you do remember even most things clearly... might that not be maddening?

@  Otaku : (23 October 2018 - 09:09 AM)

The "millions of years old" thing is probably the most alien aspect of Cybertronians.  It pushes my suspension of disbelief for anything remotely human to live that long and still be sane, or maybe even functional.  I think of how aging has affected my own view and sure, some of it is biological maturation, but a lot of it is experience.

@  wonko the sane? : (23 October 2018 - 07:11 AM)

But they don't really have a childhood either. They go online and all maturation is literally job experience.

@  Shrug : (23 October 2018 - 06:47 AM)

Well, they're practically immortal. That kind of lifespan doesn't exactly push growing up.

@  TheMightyMol... : (23 October 2018 - 04:00 AM)

They can't handle physical scale, did you think temporal scale would fare any better?

@  Pennpenn : (23 October 2018 - 03:44 AM)

Maybe it's that they're functionally intelligent, but don't ever really mature much psychologically. That and presumably the original writers gave as much of a shit about deep time as they did about space geometry.

@  Whirl Maximus : (23 October 2018 - 02:03 AM)

I'm mixed about the millions of years thing, it's somewhat at odds when transformers are humanized as they often are.

@  TM2-Megatron : (22 October 2018 - 11:59 PM)

Are any of the Transformers terribly bright, really? This is a spacefaring civilization that's millions of years old that seem to be fighting a perpetual war for no particular reason. Transformers are stupider than humans

@  wonko the sane? : (22 October 2018 - 08:31 PM)

Depends on the machine. Are you recruiting them, or MAKING them?

@  Cybersnark : (22 October 2018 - 08:30 PM)

... And not terribly bright.

@  wonko the sane? : (22 October 2018 - 07:51 PM)

Makes sense for robot soldiers: you would want something fast, low profile, but lots of power.

@  Waspinator : (22 October 2018 - 06:31 PM)

If we go by the Prime cartoon, sports cars apparently ARE the expendable troop of choice.

@  TheMightyMol... : (22 October 2018 - 04:29 PM)

Just fold 'em into a box and slap some wheels on it, they'll figure it out.

@  Pennpenn : (22 October 2018 - 01:57 AM)

Given that by the time we're up to in the story Functionalism had been dead for millions of years and many of the people around were made during and for the war, it's probably more likely that "sports car shaped thing" was an easy to make alt mode for expendable troops.

@  MEDdMI : (21 October 2018 - 09:52 PM)

maybe there's underground demolition derbies too

@  Locoman : (21 October 2018 - 09:25 PM)

Every single sports car was one of those two jobs? Considering how many there seem to be....

@  RichardT1977 : (21 October 2018 - 07:34 PM)

Athletic Entertainment

@  TheMightyMol... : (21 October 2018 - 03:32 PM)

It's mentioned in one issue that Bumblebee was a courier. The only other fast cars I can remember seeing in Functionist times were Blur and a couple of Stunticons, as racers.

@  SG Roadbuster : (21 October 2018 - 12:14 PM)

i figured the sports cars were either racers or couriers.

@  Nevermore : (21 October 2018 - 12:13 PM)

Upper Class. They're clearly not made for manual labor.

@  Locoman : (21 October 2018 - 12:09 PM)

Functionism only really makes sense for certain alternate modes like mining or construction equipment; where do things like sports cars fit in?

@  Xellos : (21 October 2018 - 11:51 AM)

At least in the movies they can switch to a (similar) alt mode at will, it seems. Especially if they want to sell more toys per movie.

@  wonko the sane? : (21 October 2018 - 10:44 AM)

They are a race of adaptive machines. Maybe they were expected to change themselves to fit the role?

@  RichardT1977 : (21 October 2018 - 10:06 AM)

IDW-verse discrimination still made more sense than the backstory in TF: Exodus, where everyone's caste was assigned seemingly at random with no regard for their aptitudes (altmode or otherwise)

@  MEDdMI : (21 October 2018 - 07:55 AM)

Lost Light is good too, so far.

@  MEDdMI : (21 October 2018 - 07:54 AM)

I'm not terribly into Transformers in general, but I did mostly enjoy the More Than Meets The Eye series.

@  Nevermore : (21 October 2018 - 05:11 AM)

Which has been in the state constitution since 1946, but was never actually executed according to documents, and is currently not in effect because the German federal constitution, which takes priority over state constitution, has banned the death penalty back in 1949.

@  Nevermore : (21 October 2018 - 05:09 AM)

Huh. So next weekend, when the German state of Hesse will have its state election, there will also be a ballot about changing the state constitution... and one of the proposed changes will be abolishing the death penalty.

@  Waspinator : (21 October 2018 - 03:44 AM)

I really need to read those comics

@  Pennpenn : (21 October 2018 - 03:28 AM)

Up to and including the fact that certain alternate modes could end up being classified as "surplus to requirements" and systematically murdered.

@  Pennpenn : (21 October 2018 - 03:26 AM)

And in IDW comics where it is/was literally a form of apartheid where your alternate mode pretty much dictated how you were treated by society, what jobs you could pursue, pretty much everything.

@  Waspinator : (21 October 2018 - 02:24 AM)

We do get hints of that from time to time in Transformers, with stuff like some jets acting smug towards cars and whatnot.

@  RichardT1977 : (20 October 2018 - 08:10 PM)

"No shotgun of Mine is going to marry a rocket launcher" sounds like something that Targetmasters (or WFC Siege Micromasters) might say...

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (20 October 2018 - 08:06 PM)

The characters are actually kinda nice. Sure a bunch of them are from New Jersey, but you get a few aliens too.. But if you do that, you might want to go digital delux verisons.

@  Xellos : (20 October 2018 - 06:38 PM)

My only issue is that the aside from Fox, the looks of the characters are kinda bland. If anything, I'll at least get it on Black Friday, as they almost always have deals on the toys to life stuff.

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (20 October 2018 - 06:07 PM)

Well I can tell you, if you are going physical version because you want the toys. The Switch version has the best Ship mount as you just slide the joycons into it. The PS4 ship mount is wired. The game itself is very good in my opionion. In some ways it starts to turn into an RTS without being an RTS. You've got to start focus on keeping your planets from being taken back over. It has a LOT to do. It does have some repitive missions, because well, trying to let you level up all pilots and ships and such. The switch version -ALSO- has starfox only missions and the characters are incorporated into the story.

@  Xellos : (20 October 2018 - 06:03 PM)

How is Starlink anyways? Been thinking of getting the Switch version for StarFox, which is quite unusal for me, as I almost always pick the PS4 versions (favorite controller and I already have so many Trophys on it).

@  Waspinator : (20 October 2018 - 05:42 PM)

No shotgun of mine is going to marry a rocket launcher!

@  TheMightyMol... : (20 October 2018 - 05:22 PM)

Should they be allowed to marry outside of their own caliber?

@  Waspinator : (20 October 2018 - 05:18 PM)

I'm conflicted on the subject of marriage rights for shotguns.

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (20 October 2018 - 03:24 PM)

You say, "Damn it, what do you think this is, a shotgun wedding?"

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (20 October 2018 - 03:23 PM)

What do you do if someone wants to bring their concealed-carry to your American wedding?

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (20 October 2018 - 01:58 PM)

Benbot, I was streaming the PS4 version of Starlink

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (20 October 2018 - 01:25 PM)

Ergo their reporting will have its own slant on the facts as they choose, not the most neutral way possible.

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (20 October 2018 - 01:24 PM)

I find it sad to realize that the prestigious New York Times which I trusted a lot as a kid in fact has its own editorial agenda.

@  Nevermore : (20 October 2018 - 01:20 PM)

The end result is NOT that stupid bullshit gets equal coverage as reasonable arguments. That would be problematic in itself (the "false balance" bias), but the provlem is that the controversial stupid bullshit gets MORE coverage than the reasonable arguments.

@  Nevermore : (20 October 2018 - 01:17 PM)

The media doesn't want to miss the opportunity to report on a controversy, and as a consequence makes sure that the controversial statements reach an audience.

@  Nevermore : (20 October 2018 - 01:17 PM)

Because they realized that saying controversial shit is guaranteed to get coverage.

@  Nevermore : (20 October 2018 - 01:16 PM)

It's the same here in Germany. Our right-wing moron party is still a political minority, yet they succeed in driving the topics the media keeps reporting.

@  Nevermore : (20 October 2018 - 01:15 PM)

The main problem was that Trump was banking on controversy, and the media was reporting controversy because it gave them ratings.

- - - - -

Prime Wars Retrospectives

74 replies to this topic

#1 Shrug


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Posted 04 August 2018 - 10:19 PM

The trilogy has come to an end. The sequel is a prequel and now all the little dudes come in two packs.

Titans Return got me back into collecting Transformers by finally putting a Powermaster Prime in front of me and dangling the bait just long enough. That same week I caught wind of G2 Combiner boxsets hitting discounts stores and before I knew it I had two combiners and a handful of Headmasters.

Things weren't perfect in my relationship with Prime Wars. I'd luck into hard to find waves at MSRP or lower only to get struck by several quality control issues. But I finally had a modern Kup I was happy with. And Overlord. And G2 colored Bruticus. And Powermaster Prime. And a pretty sweet Ultra Magnus. And a not-horrible High Brow. And a blue Swoop. And Dreadwind/Darkwing. And Sky Lynx. And Rodimus Prime. And (some) Pretenders. Oh, and Gnaw. So many Gnaws.


I never sat down and thought about how many things I never expected to happen... happened. Heck, the focus on post-movie G1 meant I started getting colors I like again.

Obviously I would have changed some things if I were the powers to be, but getting so many things I wanted is definitely better than getting none of the things I wanted. Overall, I'd say I was happy with the trilogy. As WFC shifts the aesthetic a little and we move forward, I still see several things I'll want to at least try out, but I'm glad we got this segment of collecting with late G1 characters and line-wide gimmicks involving little robots connecting to bigger robots.

So... how did the whole ordeal treat you?

Edited by Shrug, 04 August 2018 - 10:22 PM.

#2 Msol


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Posted 04 August 2018 - 10:45 PM

I wish TR would have kept going on and on. The Pretender armor was fun in Potpie, but it should have just been more Headmasters inside!

Edited by Msol, 04 August 2018 - 10:46 PM.

#3 Shrug


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Posted 04 August 2018 - 10:54 PM

Oh hey, here's another super improbable thing we got:


#4 Classic Sideways

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Posted 04 August 2018 - 11:22 PM

Prime Wars feels like it was the finale to the entire classics line starting from 2007. Between the three series it plugged so many gaps and desired characters and concepts like combiner groups and headmasters. Were the character assortments and every aesthetic choice perfect? No, but it is impressive how much we got.

I hope that War for Cybertron trilogy branches beyond basic G1, but it does seem like a good starting place for new collections.

#5 LV!


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Posted 04 August 2018 - 11:36 PM

I got a Scrounge. I don't buy Generations anymore and probably have a half-dozen toys total from all three parts, but...I have a Scrounge.


A Scrounge.

#6 Noideaforaname


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Posted 04 August 2018 - 11:36 PM

I never did complete a combiner. I got Sky Lynx, and that's it.

Hell, the only other "mainline" figures i got were sorta-Strika and okish-Obsidian (Quake and Triggerhappy). All the others have been the smaller stuff: Insecticons, Slash, Shockwave, Crashbash, Shuffler, Battleslash. Might as well not even have bothered with the gimmicks as far as i'm concerned.

#7 Exatron


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Posted 05 August 2018 - 12:03 AM

Combiners have always been my favorite TF gimmick, so CW comes in as my favorite TF line of all time. With PotP carrying on its legacy, it ranks up there as well. Right now, Devastator, Predaking, Menasor, Bruticus, and Abominus are dominating my computer desk. I just wish I had enough space to give them some more company.


Aside from all the combiners, these lines have given us some really nice collections of Headmasters, Targetmasters, a good Galvatron and Rodimus Prime (albeit not at the right relative sizes), a full set of the triple changers, and a lot of really nice surprises. And while it's not part of the PWT, having Studio Series come along during this era has just made things that much better.


Sure, I could always think of some things I would've liked even more, but as far as I'm concerned, this has been the golden age of Transformers. The only thing I can really think of that would have made me significantly happier during these last few years would be if the RiD line had given us better representations of those characters, and especially more of that series's Decepticons.

#8 Thylacine 2000

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Posted 05 August 2018 - 12:06 AM

It was a superb trilogy and looking back I wish I had been a completist for it. And it's still going out on a high note with Punch / Counterpunch!

#9 Presumed Dead

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Posted 05 August 2018 - 12:14 AM

Best Transformers figures since Cybertron

#10 ZacWilliam1

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Posted 05 August 2018 - 12:27 AM

It was SUPER expensive for me. This is how I collect right now: I buy new Generations style toys of G1 characters (and occasional G2/BW/BM) that either a) have not had a modern update before or b) are significantly improved in some way from a previous Generations style release and I organize them by year of original release.

Prime Wars has filled in nearly every 84 to 86 hole that remained some of them pretty large, done almost all of 1987 single-handedly, done a passable swipe at a chunk of 88. It was a line pretty directly aimed at me.

I say with no malice that I'd be happy if WFC aims at me a bit less and lightens my need to purchase. Those micromasters though and folks like Cog and Lionizer are still very much in my "need" category.

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#11 Adam16bit


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Posted 05 August 2018 - 12:35 AM

It's my hope it isn't over yet - there are always plenty of opportunities for weird exclusives, redeco toys, and the like at conventions or elsewhere.


What really struck me as fantastic about Combiner Wars - and the Titans Return, and Power of the Primes - is that it was pretty cohesive.  Actual play gimmicks were brought in so that almost every toy has some level of compatibility or play with other toys beyond transformation, and I don't think I heard many or any complaints.     I loved how they managed to do collector-friendly characters with generally less annoying transformations and a bunch of incredible goodies.  We got Metroplex in Thrilling 30, but the Prime Wars run got us Devastator, Fort Max, Trypticon and Predaking.   And a Headmaster Arcee, the Monsterbots, tributes to some of the rarest Japan-only toys, upgraded versions of things seemingly for no reason other than they were popular in the comics (hiya Phase Sixers), and almost all of the Minibots.  And Dinobots.  And the main three Insecticons.  And Optimus' container on a Classic toy, finally.


We weren't given all that many repaints either - we got some swell G2 items, and almost everything else had at least a new head or a pre-existing reason for a redeco.   Also the Comic-Con exclusives were generally nifty.


I'm a little surprised by a few of the things we didn't get yet.


Like we got just about every major, significant Minibot - but no Cliffjumper since the red Bumblebee of Thrilling 30.   Or a reasonably sized Generations Shockwave for the masses.  (Lovin' Cyber Battalion though.)  Or the Seacons, given they're the only US team that was left out so far.


After the slow trickle of classic characters from 2007-2013, it's kind of remarkable that we've got all the main Autobot and Decepticon Headmasters, at least one or more toy from most of the major Movie/Season 3 players, and most shocking of all we only got one Bumblebee in the last three lines.  That takes restraint.  (Granted we got, what, close to a dozen Optimus and Optimish toys?)


It's both good and bad that we are at a point now where I'd say every line ended with most of us wanting a little bit more.  More Combiners.  Full headmasters of Nightbeat, Hosehead, and so forth.   A few more mini Pretenders.  (Well, at least Trent will have something fun to make.)


From what we've seen from Siege so far it looks like new characters will be minimal, but I get it - people buy things they love, and so many of us have soft spots for Optimus, Ultra Magnus, and the 1984 cars.  But Cog and the Weaponizers have me pretty jazzed, mostly because I've been dreaming of the day I could get some awesome Target Masters.   It's also interesting that there is a clear shift from "play" to "display" now, and I have to say I'm still a little disappointed Hasbro US has had those hexagonal display stand ports on all of their toys yet has yet to make a stand for us to buy. Easy money.  I'm into it.


Here's hoping they sneak out more of the "old" Prime Wars Trilogy molds out again as repaints or retools - I'll buy combiner limbs as long as they keep making new ones.

#12 Blot


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Posted 05 August 2018 - 12:41 AM

More than anything, the thing I liked in the trilogy was the return to Classics '06 "simplicity".  In the post movie world, the figures had gotten complex in ways that made them more fiddly, with conflicting tabs and large panels hanging off thing limbs and whanot.  Not that every toy from '08 to pre-Trilogy was a Universe Sunstreaker or WFC Bumblebee, but for toys that I just want to play with, the ratio for Prime Wars is certainly a lot better than the things that came before it.


Additionally, it was Prime Wars that we really saw Hasbro step up what a retool could be.  At first we were grateful when a toy got a new head.  Then we were floored when a waist swivel could result in two "different" looking robots.  Now we have three Decepticon Targetmasters who only share legs, three Monsterbots who mostly do the same, and the sheer "what" that a helicopter, a flying bathtub, and a jet are all technically the same mold.  


I mean, I have an Abominus where only one figure is a mold that isn't shared with some other figure, and yet all five feel unique!


Also, I have an Abominus.




Blot Blot Blot Blot Blot.

#13 TF14

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Posted 05 August 2018 - 12:51 AM

I love Titan Masters and I hope we get more of them some day

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#14 lastmaximal


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Posted 05 August 2018 - 12:58 AM

The Trilogy was a resounding triumph, I feel, and I'm lucky to be in a territory with an active, listening distributor.


The main thing that stands out for me is a comment some idiot (not on here) made about the line "finally having a direction" after Archer's team. Because the only "direction" this goober understood was "giving me what I want, all Geewun With Knees all the time." But that's what any enterprise gets when it leans hard into catering to fan tastes. 


Heading into Combiner Wars I wasn't sure what to expect, but I was excited. Coming off of T30 was a huge rush, as that particular iteration of Generations was stellar -- Arcee, Chromia, Windblade, lots of MTMTE-inspired stuff, Mini-Cons. But I WAS excited, because the previews looked good. Besides, here Hasbro was, venturing into territory it had heretofore chosen not to dwell in: combiner assortments.


And what followed was a master class in mold reuse and design sharing. The same people who were giddy that the line finally had "direction" kept moaning about the number of redecos and retools when it was the only way they even GOT their beloved Combiners. My only complaints were about some engineering bits --  I am perhaps too easy to please, but it's hard to enjoy the stuff when the relevant car half doesn't hold together in arm mode. Well, those and like 1/3 of the line being the 84 crew. But hey, it HAS been an absurd amount of time since the original Classics etc molds were released, so these aren't really FOR me. 


Hasbro, the only remaining combiner I want now is a G2 Defensor. C'mon. Amazon that up. I'll be all over it.

(edit: well, the only combiner from existing molds.)


I was firmly in the minority with with Titans Return, as I didn't like that Headmasters became a linewide gimmick, meaning my improved Hot Rod and Blurr and Kup and Perceptor now had detachable heads. I AM a purist about some things, I guess, whaddyagonnado. But the molds were pretty good in general, and the Hot Rod thing got resolved handily one line later, so. :) I DID like how that gave the figures a new "bot and driver" play pattern, something that especially gave the Legends class figures a nice unifying design principle that really clicked. 


Power of the Primes was an obvious mess of a line, a mixed bag of gimmicks and characters that needed to be crossed off a list. But for all of that it was another excellent demo of mold reuse and generally fun ideas (the Evolution leaders and sure, tiny Pretenders), enough to really make it feel as cut short as it was. It's unfortunate Takara couldn't luxury up the line like they did with Unite Warriors and Legends-line TR.


The trilogy can't really be discussed without their complementary exclusives, which seemed to be very aggressive efforts from Hasbro to fill gaps, both in terms of what couldn't fit in the regular retail lineup and what couldn't be offered by the usual Club avenue. This many giftsets and exclusives was also a Generations first, IIRC. I liked them all, although one could REALLY tell it was a tough process finding avenues for them, especially with TRU's collapse. It was a rare set of lines where I went all in on these as well, from the Combiner Wars box sets to Arcee and Grotusque to the Trilogy trio from Amazon. 


I look back fondly on the trilogy, despite freely snarking at it being so obviously G1 With Knees, and hope that now that Hasbro's gotten this out of its system they can feel free to experiment more with Stege onward. While, y'know, finding room for the remaining stuff on that checklist. (And that they balance that out with plenty of Studio Series because I need a break from G1 every now and then, and without RID2015 that's harder to have.)


And it's hard not to look back fondly. Even though the line design was transparently "84-87+ checklist", it was a nice list to be crossing off and I hope we're not completely done with it. We got some real standouts and memorable releases, too.

CW - Ultra Magnus, Computron (two distinct box sets!) and SCROUNGE, Sky Lynx, Liokaiser, Rook

TR - Nautica, Finally Headmaster Arcee, Gnaw, Brawn, Galvatron, Hardhead/Quake, the Jumpstarters, Overlord

POTP - Rodimus Prime, Abominus, Battleslash/Roadtrap, Slash, Punch/Counterpunch

Edited by lastmaximal, 05 August 2018 - 01:00 AM.

Virtually every custom as good as the title suggests!

#15 Cabooceratops


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Posted 05 August 2018 - 02:13 AM

Lot of really solid concepts and engineering that ended up feeling half-baked in the execution. Didn't take any of the ideas presented anywhere nearly as far or as interesting as they could be, and PotPie was just almost entirely the junk/filler line rather than having its own design identity beyond 'shoestring budget'.


Legends Class was more or less pretty great aside from the weird Cassette thing.

Edited by Cabooceratops, 05 August 2018 - 02:14 AM.

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#16 Powered Convoy

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Posted 05 August 2018 - 07:51 AM

I love combiners, Headmasters, and Targetmasters. I got all of these here. So therefore I loved the figures originating from this line.

Edited by Powered Convoy, 05 August 2018 - 07:52 AM.

#17 ▲ndrusi


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Posted 05 August 2018 - 08:26 AM

I want Rook to hit me over the head with a combiner fist killing me instantly.

QUOTE(orionpax44 @ Jun 24 2012, 01:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Childrens toys? whaa the boxes seriously say ages 5+ I consider myself the plus.
QUOTE(mx-01 archon @ Sep 9 2012, 01:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
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#18 Broadside


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Posted 05 August 2018 - 08:36 AM

Some lovely engineering and cool new characters and designs hamstrung by a refusal to reinvent things anywhere near as much as previous Generations lines.

#19 Zodberg


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Posted 05 August 2018 - 10:46 AM

OK so the legend of the 13 first came to popularity when The Fallen was in War Within: The Dark Ages, and Vector Prime was in Cybertron. And a perhaps over-enthusiastic fandom begged for the other 12 to be patched together.

Eventually The Aligned continuity and certain binders promised us a cohesive use of them but Prime's direction was mangled and the Covenant was not as memorable as the case it came in. Those 13 were relegulated to being A 13 and not THE THIRTEEN.

So years later Alpha Lion, an awesome figure, promises another go at revealing the legends, straight from Hasbro. Who would these mysterious ancestors be?. And?

They're... tiny dudes dressed as other tiny dudes from 1988.

Oh well! At least we now get a new Titan every year. We were regularly told they were impossible with Hasbro citing drop tests.

#20 Shrug


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Posted 05 August 2018 - 10:54 AM

Yeah, I honestly sometimes forget there is any form of fiction connected to the toylines because they're just so bad and/or half-assedconverted.

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