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@  Nevermore : (17 January 2019 - 08:19 PM)

I'm also only reading the trades. So I'm still missing... two volumes that are currently only available as hardcovers? Three?

@  Trpodeca : (17 January 2019 - 06:22 PM)

Astro City is great. Since I only read the trades, there probably won't be a big change for me.

@  ZakuConvoy : (17 January 2019 - 05:34 PM)

I have. Great series. Hopefully the transition to OGNs will be a smooth one.

@  Nevermore : (17 January 2019 - 07:20 AM)

Anyone here reading Kurt Busiek's Astro City?

@  Verity Carlo : (16 January 2019 - 01:12 PM)

https://sites.google...ations---part-1awwwww shit

@  Benbot : (16 January 2019 - 12:36 PM)

Remember the Noid? He steals pizzas!

@  Steevy Maximus : (16 January 2019 - 10:47 AM)

That said, the old "Nester" character from Nintendo Power IS owned by Nintendo, and I could see a homage in there

@  Steevy Maximus : (16 January 2019 - 10:46 AM)

Because technically DiC created the character, Nintendo does not own him.

@  Paladin : (16 January 2019 - 10:28 AM)

sidebar- why is "Captain N" not in Smash yet? that seems like such an easy option.

@  wonko the sane? : (16 January 2019 - 09:18 AM)

The 90's mario cartoons had exactly three character aspects to work with: fat, italian and plumber. He wasn't exactly wrenching pipes in every episode, so they had to do something...

@  TheMightyMol... : (16 January 2019 - 07:31 AM)

It's in another castle.

@  unluckiness : (16 January 2019 - 06:24 AM)

i HOpE sHe mADe LotSA SPAGHETTI

@  Locoman : (16 January 2019 - 06:17 AM)

Mario, wherever you are, HEEEEEEEELP!

@  unluckiness : (16 January 2019 - 06:07 AM)

That's Mama Luigi to you, Mario *wheeze*

@  Pennpenn : (16 January 2019 - 02:24 AM)

It's too hot here.

@  Echowarrior : (15 January 2019 - 11:03 PM)

I liked the Super Mario Brothers Super Show the best myself.

@  Sabrblade : (15 January 2019 - 10:35 PM)

There's always the three Mario cartoons DiC made back in the 80s.

@  wonko the sane? : (15 January 2019 - 09:48 PM)

So they could make a show that everyone would scream was an adventure time knockoff? I get what you're saying, but I can't see it being well received.

@  Sean Whitmore : (15 January 2019 - 08:47 PM)

The fact that Adventure Time was on the air for 8 years and at no point did Nintendo hand the creators a large sack of money and say, "Please make a Mario thing for us" will forever anger me.

@  wonko the sane? : (15 January 2019 - 07:03 PM)

There was so much awesome put into design and conception of the super mario bros. movie, and it didn't even need the branding: but it wouldn't have made it to the screen without the branding.

@  TM2-Megatron : (15 January 2019 - 06:56 PM)

Many aspects of it have stuck in my memory, though. The boots, the devolution ray, the aesthetic of the dinosaur city

@  TM2-Megatron : (15 January 2019 - 06:55 PM)

I had no idea there was another Mario Bros. movie coming out, though. Doubt it'll top the first one, it was just so bizarre

@  TM2-Megatron : (15 January 2019 - 06:55 PM)

They already act a bit like minions; they just aren't stupid

@  wonko the sane? : (15 January 2019 - 05:35 PM)

The trouble is: I honestly can't decide if making them minions would be better or worse than the continuously shrill voices they've used for the last 20 years.

@  Paladin : (15 January 2019 - 05:27 PM)

hope everyone's ready for Toads to look, act & sound like the Minions forever...

@  Lancer : (15 January 2019 - 04:54 PM)

I mean, considering Illumination is making the new Mario movie, Super Mario Bros. 1993 won't be the worst Mario movie anymore

@  Sabrblade : (15 January 2019 - 04:36 PM)

"Sir, your pizza's here." "Not now!"

@  wonko the sane? : (15 January 2019 - 04:28 PM)

Actually, yeah. I think I need to watch it again. Great movie.

@  PlutoniumBoss : (15 January 2019 - 03:44 PM)

It's a fun movie with amazing sets. As long as you don't try to connect it to anything else Mario, it's fine.

@  TM2-Megatron : (15 January 2019 - 03:38 PM)

Damn, I haven't thought about the Super Mario Bros. feature film in forever. Need to watch it again, soon; I can only imagine it gets better with time.

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (15 January 2019 - 03:21 PM)

Re:Zero is a fantastic series.

@  ▲ndrusi : (15 January 2019 - 03:10 PM)

Yeah it's not a bad concept, it's just that lately the term is associated with "I, a Loser Everyman, Woke Up In a Generic Fantasy Setting Where I'm Super Special So Now Girls Orbit Me"

@  Sabrblade : (15 January 2019 - 12:59 PM)

So too is the old Super Mario Bros movie

@  wonko the sane? : (15 January 2019 - 12:28 PM)

I went and looked up the term "isekai"... that's not actually as bad as I thought it was going to be.

@  ▲ndrusi : (15 January 2019 - 12:19 PM)

I'm not sure, but the cartoon segments of The Super Mario Bros. Super Show are.

@  PlutoniumBoss : (15 January 2019 - 12:12 PM)

Wait. A. Minute. Is Blaster Master an isekai?

@  MEDdMI : (15 January 2019 - 08:49 AM)

*Dragon Slave*

@  Xellos : (15 January 2019 - 06:22 AM)

I used to use a pic like that as my avatar for years, but that... is a secret.

@  PlutoniumBoss : (15 January 2019 - 02:07 AM)

Is Flatland an isekai?

@  MEDdMI : (14 January 2019 - 11:16 PM)

@Xellos Every time I see you post, I picture Xellos' infuriating smug grin and finger waggling with the "sore wa hi*mi*tsu*desu <3"

@  Waspinator : (14 January 2019 - 09:50 PM)

The Last Starfighter is also one of those

@  Cybersnark : (14 January 2019 - 09:28 PM)

Astronaut gets shot through a wornhole and ends up on a living starship full of escaped alien prisoners.

@  Cybersnark : (14 January 2019 - 09:28 PM)

I realized a few months ago that Farscape is a sci-fi-based Isekai.

@  Sabrblade : (14 January 2019 - 09:03 PM)

The Thor movies and Enchanted, as well.

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (14 January 2019 - 08:45 PM)

@xellos We get to many of those in Hollywood movies.

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (14 January 2019 - 08:13 PM)

Re:Creators!

@  Xellos : (14 January 2019 - 07:47 PM)

There is also Aesthetica of a Rogue Hero, where people regularly get summoned to a fantasy world, then eventually sent back with their accumulated powers (and the main character smuggles the demon lord's daugher by his request, which is a no-no)

@  Waspinator : (14 January 2019 - 07:23 PM)

We need more inverse isekais, like The Devil is a Part-Timer

@  ▲ndrusi : (14 January 2019 - 04:11 PM)

I feel like Tron is pushing it but I can't actually come up with an argument to that effect

@  Pennpenn : (14 January 2019 - 03:21 PM)

To Arazyr- I don't see why it wouldn't be.


Photo
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James Cameron's Alita is actually a real thing?!


177 replies to this topic

#21 2019

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 06:17 AM

 

but the problem and the responsibility relating to Asian actors in American film is not an anime adaptation problem, it's industry-wide.

 

Doesn't make it any less worth complaining about?


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#22 Copper Bezel

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 06:28 AM

It's just conspicuous attention when it comes up primarily in reference to anime adaptations and the like. Like, yes, this film's source material came with an easy "justification" for putting an Asian actor in a particular principal role (and specifically a Japanese actor). Maybe that constitutes a missed opportunity. But it's ultimately no more important for him to be played by an Asian actor than ... pick an action blockbuster, a random principal character, and an ethnicity from your side of the planet. So I feel it's conflating two separate issues, and the important one doesn't have a whole lot to do with this film in particular. 

 

Edit: If you're already looking at films like this as a vehicle for pitching Asian actor roles, though, I guess I can see that "missed opportunity" as having a bigger bearing on the broader issue.


Edited by Copper Bezel, 09 December 2017 - 06:34 AM.

Shouldn't gravity be doing something?
 
Of course there's a figure of Rodimus as some kind of animal girl. Why would I be surprised by this?

 


#23 2019

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 06:42 AM

 

Edit: If you're already looking at films like this as a vehicle for pitching Asian actor roles, though, I guess I can see that "missed opportunity" as having a bigger bearing on the broader issue.

 

Pretty much. If people keep going to whitewashed movies, Hollywood will be even less likely to consider not whitewashing in the future.


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#24 Verity Carlo

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 01:08 PM

DQjU37JW0AAtYuZ.png


 

staring dog stares

doggie_zpsafvtedef.png


#25 Ironbite

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 07:01 PM

.... hug

xC9l3eY.gif


#26 Maruten

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 07:12 PM

It would be better obviously if this was a Japanese movie full of Japanese people. But it's an American movie based on a Japanese property. Assuming it isn't still full of stuff that's trying to be Japanese (which I gather GITS unfortunately was?) there isn't any particular reason for Ido (or etc) to retain Japaneseness beyond general respect for diversity, right? It's not a This Was Japanese And Must Remain Japanese thing. It's an American remake like Ring or Power Rangers or the Magnificent Seven. I mean, Power Rangers probably isn't a good example really because there's a whole other layer of stuff happening there where they're actively pretending that the Japanese dudes in their original footage are a bunch of kids from Ohio or whatever as soon as they take off their hats. I don't know how we feel about that. It's basically the same as, say, The Office, right? You're rebuilding from the ground up as an American product. You don't have to cast a whole lot of Brits.

There are a lot of different angles here. At the root we have "should American dudes be buying up the rights to make dodgy remakes of Japanese classics in the first place". After that we get to "if they throw some Japanese stuff in as a nod to the source material, how respectful and/or problematic will it end up being". It's also wrinkled by the whole science fiction animation thing. UnlikeThe Office they can have a Belgian woman voicing a dinosaur from Neptune. Which might score them extra points, or might make a bigger mess.

These aren't really worms I want to uncan. I think my nutshell is This Is a Wholly American And Shouldn't Have To Pretend Not To Be. Which isn't to say that they have a pass to exclude diversity-related thinking from their casting processes, but The Manga Was Japanese So The American Movie Has To Be Japanese I'm not sure on.

WsuGTl1.jpg


#27 Internet Jesus

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 08:14 PM

I don't really care about the adaptation/casting issues, Alita just triggers my Uncanny Valley and I want it out of existence.



#28 Teufel

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 09:03 PM

Woo, another Asian property with white actors.

 

:???

 

Link

 

 

The futuristic dystopian world of Battle Angel Alita revolves around the metropolis known as the Scrapyard,

 

 

The story takes place in the former United States. According to a map printed in Fallen Angel Scrapyard and Tiphares are near Kansas City, Missouri, and the Necropolis is Colorado Springs, Colorado. Radio KAOS is at Dallas, Texas. Figure's coastal hometown is Alhambra, California. Desty Nova's Granite Inn is built out of a former military base - NORAD at Cheyenne Mountain, Colorado.[1]

 

White people in a dystopian former United States? smdh!

 

Rosa Salazar - Alita
Christoph Waltz
Jennifer Connelly
Mahershala Ali
Ed Skrein
Jackie Earle Haley
Keean Johnson
Michelle Rodriguez
Lana Condor (part Vietnamese)
Elza Gonzalez
Idara Victor
Jorge Lendeborg Jr
Leonard Wu
Marko Zaror

 

Actually pretty diverse, although that's undoubtedly in no small part because of Robert Rodriguez.

 

Right, but they've explicitly changed main Japanese character Daisuke Ido into a white dude named Dyson Ido, so uh...

 

Posted Image

 

Are you sure he wasn't just a weeaboo?

 

On another note, this animatronic Lincoln reminded me of Alita.

 



#29 2019

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 09:58 PM

I mean, sure, the fiction can be used to wipe away a specific complaint that applies as a general comment about Hollywood. I guess it doesn't matter anyway. Forget I said anything.


Edited by 2017, 09 December 2017 - 10:03 PM.

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#30 Telly

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 10:32 PM

The original, in both media, is a great classic of a bygone era, a sparkling gem in a sea of bland cyberpunk nonsense. Do they still make bland cyberpunk nonsense? I almost miss it. Back in the olden days, you took whatever shitty anime you could find and you were grateful for it.

 

assuming you could FIND any! there was a supermarket in my town with a video section and i found a couple there (macross clash of the bionoids [aka an edited version of dyrl], and revenge of the ninja wariior [aka an edited version of dagger of kamui]). found a harlock video at kaybee toys i think. things got better when the 90s arrived

 

being an anime fan in the 80s pretty much sucked :(


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#31 Blot

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Posted 09 December 2017 - 11:07 PM

 

5688-1336707636_zpsncgo8o8r.png

 

Egon?



#32 Maruten

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Posted 10 December 2017 - 02:14 AM

I mean, sure, the fiction can be used to wipe away a specific complaint that applies as a general comment about Hollywood. I guess it doesn't matter anyway. Forget I said anything.

As a general complaint about Hollywood, I'm right there with you. I don't know what the missing steps are between No Representation, Offensive Tropery, and Everything Is Better, but hopefully we get that sorted out soon. Should there be a place in this movie, and every movie, and TV show, and etc, for people who aren't obnoxious white dudes? Absolutely.

And true, Ido (despite his Japanese name) has never looked remotely Japanese and why would he, the story is set in America etc, sure. But how many anime and manga characters DO look Japanese? But they still are Japanese, and/or have that Japanese context baked in. You can't necessarily just divorce the character from that heritage simply because they happen to look like RGB Egon (which, thanks for that, can't unsee :) ).

AAAAAANYWAY I love the manga and I hope this movie doesn't suck. I must pop over to ComiXology and replace my twenty year old trades. I don't have much patience for the motorball stuff but on the whole, it's gold. Interesting that even in this relatively enlightened time we're still stuck with that Battle Angel Alita dressing and we still aren't getting a translation of Gunnm starring a chick called Gally.

Edited by Maruten, 10 December 2017 - 02:15 AM.

WsuGTl1.jpg


#33 Destron D-69

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Posted 10 December 2017 - 03:14 AM

Casting white people in Akira I could understand the issue... but these characters look as Japanese as I do.

 

which I don't. 

 

Next people are going to be offended if Roy Fokker is played by a white guy.

 

 roy-fokker-robotech-the-macross-saga-0.55.jpg

 

Clearly the Japaneseiest Japanese guy ever to come from Japan ... can't you tell...

 

O_o 



#34 2019

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Posted 10 December 2017 - 03:24 AM

Oh please, if you made his hair black he'd look exactly as Japanese as his subordinate Hikaru. Anime is styled and doesn't resemble real humans 90% of the time, everyone knows this and it's a dummy point.


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#35 Copper Bezel

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Posted 10 December 2017 - 06:27 AM

Yeah, anime Japan has always had blonde people and has a fair minority of blue-haired, pink-haired, and purple-eyed folks. It's really helpful for viewers like me with moderate face-blindness who can't even tell Hollywood actors apart half the time if they have the same hair styles. And Kamen rider is hard, mang. 

 

I mean, sure, the fiction can be used to wipe away a specific complaint that applies as a general comment about Hollywood. I guess it doesn't matter anyway. Forget I said anything.

That's pretty much where I am with it, yeah. :shrug: It's tiring to see it come up with every anime property that gets a Hollywood treatment, since such movies generally have enough problems of their own to deal with. Half the posts in this thread indicate that Alita's eyes are going to be a similar challenge already. Personally, I'm seeing a treatment that makes sense of a manga property that can actually be handled in a Hollywood movie, by a reasonably sensible director. And kinda digging some of the design work we're seeing.


Shouldn't gravity be doing something?
 
Of course there's a figure of Rodimus as some kind of animal girl. Why would I be surprised by this?

 


#36 Destron D-69

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Posted 10 December 2017 - 09:49 AM

yeah. it's going to be a great movie. and moaning equality transgressions aren't going to make me feel bad for it actually casting people that they wanted instead of bowing to pressure and getting somebody killed like Deadpool two.

 

Adaptation. Some people just can't English good  



#37 Maruten

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Posted 10 December 2017 - 05:12 PM

I think those eyes on Alita are crazy and ill-advised (though on a rewatch they don't seem as bad as I initially thought), but Christoph Waltz in Ido sauce looks to be a great example of how to do this kind of creepy human/CGI hybrid design right. It's him, but tweaked enough to bring out extra Ido and I think it works. 

 

It's still a kind of disturbing point on the human > cartoon spectrum, but clearly that's deliberate and I'm basically happy to applaud them for that. 

 

It's obviously a project that  Cameron is very passionate about given how long he's been working on it, so I wish them all the best. If you're going to adapt a manga series in Hollywood there are worse books to pick - it lends itself to an American remake better than many would. It might still be crap though obviously. 

 

It certainly has a better chance of not being dreadful than Akira, which is very sad because Akira is a vast masterpiece in its original form and deserves a better adaptation than the movie it got. I would love to see Akira adapted properly as an anime TV series or three or four movies. 


WsuGTl1.jpg


#38 Dante

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Posted 10 December 2017 - 06:28 PM

Casting white people in Akira I could understand the issue... but these characters look as Japanese as I do.

 

which I don't. 

 

Next people are going to be offended if Roy Fokker is played by a white guy.

 

 attachicon.gifroy-fokker-robotech-the-macross-saga-0.55.jpg

 

Clearly the Japaneseiest Japanese guy ever to come from Japan ... can't you tell...

 

O_o 

At least Sunrise didn't give Roy a random Japanese name.  Unlike, say, a certain white Canadian-American Gundam protagonist.

 

Oddly no one complains about Hikaru being changed to Rick, though.


Edited by Dante, 10 December 2017 - 06:30 PM.


#39 Benbot

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Posted 10 December 2017 - 08:30 PM

I wish James Cameron would invest some time in getting The Abyss and True Lies released on a format newer than DVD... between this and his 15 or whatever Avatar sequels it seems like it'll never happen.

 

The recent 4K edition of Terminator 2 has been something of a disaster, too.

Why, what's wrong with it?  What happened?



#40 Cybersnark

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Posted 11 December 2017 - 12:59 PM

And true, Ido (despite his Japanese name) has never looked remotely Japanese and why would he, the story is set in America etc,

Because (and this is the key point about representation in American-made media): there are ethnically-Asian people living in America, who are as "American" as any white person.

The problem isn't the lack of Asian people, it's the default assumption that "American" = "white" (which, BTW, is why other countries often don't see the problem, because they think America is 99% white people, because that's how America has presented itself onscreen for decades).



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