432 replies to this topic

[Steevy Maximus]

So, this will get lengthy so might want to pull up a chair:

Harmony Gold has a LONG history being rather litigious with its "ownership" of the Robotech brand and the 3 anime series that compose it.  Well, that might be changing....

 

Long story short:

HG filed suit against Piranha Games (Mechwarrior Online) , Catalyst Game Labs (Battletech RPG core license), Harebrained Schemes (Battletech PC game, licensed from CGL), and Jordan Weisman (founder/owner of HBS, involved in original case between Harmony Gold and FASA) over infringements on its rights to the Macross mechanic concepts which formed the foundation for early Battletech designs.  In this instance, they are arguing on infringement caused by the "Reseen" redesigns of the original Japanese mecha designs.  And for some reason, have NOW started going after designs like Atlus which was created by FASA themselves (comparing the Atlus to the Armored Valkyrie is REALLY reaching), in addition to several other designs originating from FASA, like the Hunchback.  They did this several weeks ago.

Leonard French's read on the docket:

 

However, just last week, an Arbitration was awarded detailing the exact situation between Harmony Gold and Tatsunoko concerning Robotech and the original series.  It's a doozy:

 

AND the short (too late) version:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XoMs6iYXyng&t=302s

 

So...to sum up...on March 14, 2021, Harmony Gold's rights to Robotech, Macross and everything else from Tatsunoko reverts back to the Japanese company, who has full authority to do whatever they want, it seems.  Until then, HG retain full rights to exploit all assets and materials they have, EXCLUDING 41 graphic designs from Big West.  And reportedly, among those 41 designs are mecha designs Harmony Gold are filing infringement on behalf of in the Battletech case.

 

Wow, what a mess of a rights case, but it DOES seems that Harmony Gold's grasp on Macross in the US might finally be coming to an end.  I think?  Depending on how an appeal might go?

[Paladin]

This could be why push has resumed for a live-action Robotech movie.

 

https://www.forbes.c...n/#4ed372111109

 

 

if that goes through, I can imagine it will let Harmony Gold keep their clutches on the license even longer.

[Jet]

Somewhere, Jetfire is throwing a party.

[Telly]

i can imagine tatsunoko or big west or whoever are anxious to get the license back. theres an entire COUNTRY (does HG's deal cover canada as well?) of fans wanting new merch and shows that HG just isnt doing anything about. well, aside from a comic series every few years (that doesnt last) and a lawsuit every few months.

 

march 15th 2021: the day we are FLOODED with macross stuff lol or at least we will start hearing announcements of macross stuff FINALLY coming here without having to import

[ZacWilliam1]

I like Robotech dearly and have zero interest in "Macross" as a non-Robotech thing and I still think it's well past time for Harmony Gold to die. They haven't shown any ability to use the property well since the actual original Robotech Toon ended 30+ years ago.

ZacWilliam, and if I can get new/better Mospeda stuff someday that I can pretend is part of Robotech, I'll take it.

[Echowarrior]

...yeah, I'll celebrate on March 15, 2021. Still, I think we can safely say that Harmony Gold bit off far more than it could chew.

[Fortress Ironhold]

Started a separate discussion on this up in the "Dungeons & Dragons & other things" thread up in Fun & Games. As part of it, I noted HBS' legal response. 

 

Some of the HBS designs that HG said infringed are clearly unrelated. Nutshell: the designs they identified as being derivative were not; rather, they fingered a provably FASA-original design (FASA being the company that first created Battletech) and a pair of designs that were derivative of Sunrise-owned mecha rather than Macross mecha. This, and other issues, gives HBS firm ground for fighting back. 

[NovaSaber]

Does it all revert or only the Big West series? A lot of what's being said doesn't seem to apply to MOSPEADA.

Unlike Macross and Southern Cross, MOSPEADA was fully owned by Tatsunoko, and thus "Tatsunoko never even had the right to license it the way Harmony Gold thinks it did" doesn't apply.

[tec]

Good riddance theres a whole back log of great Macross goodies that needs a state side release

[Powered Convoy]

If this is true, it's about time and literally should have come about 20 years ago (from 2017).

So much potential for Macross outside of Japan. So much squandered after all these years.

I will fully celebrate.

[Maruten]

I can't see how this would make Robotech much more "dead" than it already is. Even if they lose their rights to the source material, I'm sure they'll continue to drag some ailing mockery of Robotech around behind them. They long ago started trying to put some distance between their new content and the contentious elements of the OSM; I'm sure they have enough US-original characters at their disposal from Sentinels, McKinney etc to keep trying to stay afloat in some sad capacity. I mean, nobody else has any claim on the Robotech brand, right? Its value with the Macross bits stripped out is negligible obviously, but that's not a significant dip from where it is now. 

 

This is all assuming there isn't some agreement reached or new twist before 2021. HG will move mountains to keep some grip on this stuff, because without it they're nothing. Does Harmony Gold have the clout to fix this? Quite probably not, sure. Maybe they can con Sony into being their muscle if this live action movie is something that they're seriously keen on.

 

I'd love to see everything Macross available worldwide, not necessarily because I personally need that in my life, but countless people are gagging for it, and moreover HG are just bastards for obstructing everything (for absolutely no legitimate reason). But I also want Robotech to survive. I'd really like to see HG just sell Robotech to somebody nicer and smarter, and then disappear in a puff of smoke. If they love Robotech, they should set it free. Maybe they can rehome it with somebody who's friendly with Tatsunoko etc. 

 

At any rate, 2021 is a long way off and I sincerely doubt this story is already over. 

[NotVeryKnightly]

HG will move mountains to keep some grip on this stuff, because without it they're nothing.

Aren't they normally a real estate company anyway?

[unluckiness]

So that means they can literally move(legal ownership of) mountains

[GodSentinelOmega]

I really hope that this turns out, because HG deserves to have the rights ripped away from them.

I loved the original Robotech, even though as a kid the only three Robotech things i ever saw were Codename: Robotech (a sortof movie length Glovals report), Robotech the Movie (that did/rewrite/hackjob of Megazone 23), and Robotech II:The Sentinels (the movie of the only episodes of that series they ever got to make). It wasn't til years later when i finally got the whole thing on DVD that i saw the whole story, the three shows and why the mecha designs changed so much. I kinda liked Shadow Chronicles and was really hoping that this might have been the start of something new. A final adventure to round of the series.

But no. That, the fact the HG cannot bear to have even the tiniest smidgen of Macross spread with going mental, apart from a few exceptions. Their penchant for sueing everything in sight for infringement, constant rerererererere-rereleases of the old shows. Or even unreleased (outside of japan) clip show movies like Love Live Alive.

I think for final nail in their coffin for me, after the insanity of their lawsuit about the SDCC Joe/Transformers Jetfire, was their Kickstarter for a Robotech series. Which piqued my interest until it was clear that it would be just a side story going back in the timeline. Not something to push the story further forward.

Would i like Robotech as a franchise to survive? Absolutely! Just drag it out of the weasly claws of the company that seems to not care about it beyond using it to sue everyone and the Kitchen sink.

Lets have Macross finally allowed out into the world AND have somebody who cares do something good with Robotech.

But yeah, 2021 as a long way off and a lot can happen. I have my fingers crossed.

[Powered Convoy]

I wouldn't have a problem if they weren't the ones that put a stop to practically anything Macross being released in the US since Macross Plus.

 

I remember when they were threatening collectors who were buying Bandai and Yamato Valkyries and wanted them to buy their Toynami Veritechs.  Threatening customers stating that the people purchasing them needed to send the Bandai or Yamato Valkyries to Harmony Gold because they were buying unlicensed and unsanctioned merchandise.

[000]

They tried to pull that shit with their SDCC Jetfire lawsuit too, seeking to confiscate all stock including purchased pieces. HG and its lawyers can get hugged with a broken bottle.

[Ryougabot]

[D Buster Prime]

I don't understand all the hate for Harmony Gold regarding Jetfire. They paid for the exclusive rights to something, and fought to maintain it.

Hasbro would do the same thing if Mattel released action figures that looked like Optimus Prime.

It's just a part of the system/game.

[Fortress Ironhold]

I don't understand all the hate for Harmony Gold regarding Jetfire. They paid for the exclusive rights to something, and fought to maintain it.

Hasbro would do the same thing if Mattel released action figures that looked like Optimus Prime.

It's just a part of the system/game.

It's part of the larger history with Harmony Gold. 

 

If they even think that someone is infringing on their intellectual property, they send out the lawyers. 

 

It's straight-up fatigue at this point. 

[ZacWilliam1]

Yeah, if HG had been good stewards of the property people would be inclined to let the Jetfire lawsuit by I would think.

Instead HG has sat on the property doing very little with it for 30 years, held on to and used their rights in ways that seem excessive and beyond the original scope and intention, prevented big swaths of popular material from Japan from getting any sort of US release, and been lawsuit happy in the extreme suing everyone from fans to other companies for any imagined infringement in quite a few very questionable cases. They've created a very negative impression with most fans of their property. In some ways they're almost the IP owner equivalent of a patent troll. And thus they get very little slack.

ZacWilliam, it's been awhile since I read about it but I think they're mostly a real estate company right? The Robotech rights are just something they jealously clutch and try to squeeze some cash from on the side of their actual business with as little output as possible?

Edited by ZacWilliam1, 23 August 2017 - 02:24 AM.