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@  Maximus Ambus : (11 August 2020 - 03:52 AM)

Others say Joe sat down at this pond next to these ducks but really there's just no place in this world for an old man and his ducks.

@  Nevermore : (10 August 2020 - 06:48 PM)

Even worse when I can produce those verifiable facts at a later point, and then the other person simply claims the argument was the other way round (as in, I was actually arguing their position and vice versa).

@  Nevermore : (10 August 2020 - 06:47 PM)

I can argue with people about my versus their memory of events when verifiable facts are not readily available, though, and I get really annoyed when I'm capable of presenting a precise, step-by-step summary with multiple key points that can be used for future verification, and the other person just goes "nope, wrong" without going into detail.

@  Nevermore : (10 August 2020 - 06:45 PM)

I forget things, and I misremember things. But when presented with verifiable facts, my reaction is more like "Huh, could have sworn it was like that", not "this reality is not my own".

@  Nevermore : (10 August 2020 - 06:43 PM)

I have an extremely good memory (which I have proven time and again), and even I can be mistaken.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (10 August 2020 - 06:40 PM)

Might be worth pointing out that it only became "Mandela Effect" and not just "I remembered this wrong" when a conspiracy theorist insisted it was proof of alternate timelines.

@  Otaku : (10 August 2020 - 06:29 PM)

Incorrectly remembering Nelson Mandela's fate may be uniquely American... but is it really that strange to get South African political history wrong when you're no where near South Africa?

@  Otaku : (10 August 2020 - 06:29 PM)

I always assumed the Mandela Effect was a "human thing", not an American thing.

@  wonko the sane? : (10 August 2020 - 02:03 PM)

Then there are people who outright manufacture memories for whatever reason.

@  PlutoniumBoss : (10 August 2020 - 01:13 PM)

The human brain is so flaky that it is extremely unlikely that a given person does NOT have any false memories.

@  OverDrive73 : (10 August 2020 - 01:05 PM)

Perhaps it's simple word association the movie Sinbad and then our minds apply the same memories to a man named Sinbad.

@  OverDrive73 : (10 August 2020 - 01:04 PM)

The Mandela Effect is the same as people remembering Sinbad in a movie where he played a genie... Of which he never did.

@  MidnightFox : (10 August 2020 - 09:36 AM)

People that believe Mandela Effect things would rather come up with any number of reasons as to why their version doesn't have any actual evidence(like alternate timelines collapsing into our own) than just admit they remembered something wrong

@  MidnightFox : (10 August 2020 - 09:35 AM)

Sort of. It's more that when presented with a verifiable fact, they double down because it's what they believe instead of changing their minds

@  ▲ndrusi : (10 August 2020 - 09:25 AM)

"I could have sworn that ______."

@  ▲ndrusi : (10 August 2020 - 09:25 AM)

I'm not arguing with either of those two statements, but they're not really connected. Mandela Effect is, to oversimplify, people being widely mistaken about what they think *is* a verifiable fact. Nothing to do with opinions.

@  MidnightFox : (10 August 2020 - 08:52 AM)

Pretty sure the Mandela Effect in general is an American thing. Opinion > Verifiable Facts is sadly a pretty American thing

@  Nevermore : (10 August 2020 - 04:27 AM)

Ask these people how Apartheid ended according to their recollection, and I'm sure they'll draw a blank.

@  Nevermore : (10 August 2020 - 04:25 AM)

You got two black anti-Apartheid activists who were imprisoned by the oppressive regime. One died, the other was Nelson Mandela. It's not a far stretch that Americans who don't know many details about the history of other countries would mix up the two.

@  Nevermore : (10 August 2020 - 04:24 AM)

My own theory is that these people are simply mixing up Nelson Mandela and Steve Biko, another South African anti-Apartheid activist, who did indeed die in police custody in 1977. There was an Oscar-nominated movie about his life starring Denzel Washington that came out in 1987, the same time frame these people claim remembering Mandela dying.

@  Nevermore : (10 August 2020 - 04:17 AM)

I met a few people from South Africa, and they either never heard of the phenomenon at all, or only know of it from the internet. Apparently, it's completely unknown in South Africa, and it might even be entirely limited to the United States.

@  Nevermore : (10 August 2020 - 04:16 AM)

So does anyone remember the "Mandela Effect"? I'm talking specifically about the original case where many people vividly remember Nelson Mandela dying in prison in the 1980s.

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (10 August 2020 - 03:16 AM)

Crisis of Corona.

@  TheMightyMol... : (09 August 2020 - 06:16 PM)

Which crisis crossover are we on now? I lost track.

@  Rycochet : (09 August 2020 - 05:18 PM)

Much of the past decade has been the part of the comic series where less than stellar authors have driven the series into the ground and the editors are getting ready to either do a big multi issue crossover, leading to a reboot.

@  Bass X0 : (09 August 2020 - 02:28 PM)

At this point I've just decided to consider 2020 "not canon."

@  TheMightyMol... : (09 August 2020 - 02:18 PM)

'member Pepperidge Farm?

@  Maximus Ambus : (09 August 2020 - 02:10 PM)

Before the 'member berries there was Pepperidge farm. Pepperidge farm remembers.

@  OverDrive73 : (09 August 2020 - 12:21 PM)

>>>Shameless Plug<<< FYI. posted the last part of Quest for Tires in Allspark Pictures

@  SG Roadbuster : (08 August 2020 - 01:53 PM)

@Nevermore yes.

@  Nevermore : (08 August 2020 - 09:11 AM)

Is $30 a good deal for Subscription Service Breakdown?

@  Trpodeca : (08 August 2020 - 06:24 AM)

Oh dear God no. Twitter has changed it's default layout to the terrible new one. Why waste so much space on the left?

@  Steevy Maximus : (07 August 2020 - 08:28 PM)

@Bass X0, yeah, the Joe comic got REALLY solid in the upper 20s to the Cobra Civil War. It's interesting to see how well the Joe comic has aged relative to the cartoon. Where as I feel the opposite is true of Transformers

@  -LittleAutob... : (07 August 2020 - 03:58 PM)

Its so fun watching past TF Conventions.

@  Bass X0 : (07 August 2020 - 02:20 PM)

I've been reading classic 80s G.I. Joe lately. Its still decent even though I don't have any nostalgia towards it.

@  Sabrblade : (07 August 2020 - 08:50 AM)

Think of it as Adam West Batman instead. ;)

@  wonko the sane? : (07 August 2020 - 07:49 AM)

That sounds more like the flash, or maybe booster gold than batman.

@  Sabrblade : (07 August 2020 - 12:27 AM)

They would get bored fighting each other and instead decide to take an epic cross-country road trip together.

@  RichardT1977 : (06 August 2020 - 08:57 PM)

What would happen if Batman were to fight Squirrel Girl?

@  PlutoniumBoss : (04 August 2020 - 09:03 PM)

Unless you count the Mask vs Lobo special, but that's less a duel and more a duet.

@  PlutoniumBoss : (04 August 2020 - 08:52 PM)

My favorite crossover fight was Thor vs Shazam/Captain Marvel. Early in the fight, Thor discovers that Billy Batson needs lightning to transform, and being a god of lightning he simply denies him that.

@  Sabrblade : (04 August 2020 - 08:46 PM)

Let's see a fight between Death Battle and Super Power Beat Down

@  TheMightyMol... : (04 August 2020 - 06:15 PM)

Which Lobo later claimed was because he was paid to take a dive. Yes, really.

@  TheMightyMol... : (04 August 2020 - 06:15 PM)

And then there's the times it's been decided by a fan vote, which is how we get things like Lobo (who can go toe-to-toe with Superman at full strength) losing to Wolverine.

@  Nevermore : (04 August 2020 - 05:49 PM)

And then there are the "but my favorite characater will totes win because I say so" people.

@  Nevermore : (04 August 2020 - 05:49 PM)

I mean, there are some people who really approach this from a somewhat reasonable standpoint, coming up with a plausible scenario and a setting that creates a fair environment that doesn't favor one character.

@  Nevermore : (04 August 2020 - 05:46 PM)

My favorite stupid "why would they even fight each other" question recently was about three versions of Optimus Prime (G1, Bayverse and Aligned).

@  Nevermore : (04 August 2020 - 05:45 PM)

Batman obviously can beat everyone. Even Galactus. He's Batman. He's so smart, he'll just throw a Batarang and hit the weak spot at Galactus's forehead, knocking him out instantaneously.

@  wonko the sane? : (04 August 2020 - 11:37 AM)

It's almost like all drama is just manufactured pissing contests to keep us all entertained and distracted. :p

@  Tm_Silverclaw : (04 August 2020 - 10:16 AM)

Or they could go White Ranger vs Scorpion route and have both win. ;P


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DC Rebirth Discussion: The Watchmenening

New 52 DC Rebirth Watchmen

96 replies to this topic

#21 Rust

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Posted 21 May 2016 - 11:07 AM

 

Wouldn't the Watchman Universe be a veritable utopia of global cooperation in the wake of Ozymandias' plans, though?
 
I mean, Watchmen ended on the note that the thing super heroes fight for had come to pass.
 
So of course it's going to end with Batman revealing to the public at large the truth behind the deception.


I believe Watchmen ended on the note that someone found the journal and everything that had just been bought with monumental death might come to nothing. So, theoretically, the world after Watchmen has at least as much chance of being a mess as a Utopia.
 

 

It's been years, but I thought the Journal was found and was being passed off as fluff piece editorials for slow news days.



#22 ZacWilliam1

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Posted 21 May 2016 - 11:22 AM

No. It ends with the guy reaching into a pile of stuff to possibly publish and pulling out the journal. When the journal is read the secret of what happened is out. How the reader, and the world react to that is left entirely open.

It could be dismissed as 9/11 ish crackpot conspiracy or it could absolutely destroy everything Ozmandias did. Watchman makes no hint it just ends with it being found and about to be read and the secret will be out.

-ZacWilliam, so we're left 50/50 on the world falling apart again.

Edited by ZacWilliam1, 21 May 2016 - 11:23 AM.

Ever wonder about the speed of Turbofoxes?
Or the proverbial ailerons of Titanium Moosebots?

*Visit the one and only Cybertronic Bestiary.
For a mechazoologic tour of the mechanimals of Cybertron.


#23 Glenn

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Posted 21 May 2016 - 05:24 PM

another reboot, another hand..



#24 Fortress Ironhold

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Posted 21 May 2016 - 08:06 PM

No. It ends with the guy reaching into a pile of stuff to possibly publish and pulling out the journal. When the journal is read the secret of what happened is out. How the reader, and the world react to that is left entirely open.

It could be dismissed as 9/11 ish crackpot conspiracy or it could absolutely destroy everything Ozmandias did. Watchman makes no hint it just ends with it being found and about to be read and the secret will be out.

-ZacWilliam, so we're left 50/50 on the world falling apart again.

IIRC, the final panel does show that the ketchup stain on the guy's shirt makes it look exactly like the bloody Comedian pin from the very beginning of the book, suggesting ominous happenings either way.



#25 Johnny Here

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Posted 21 May 2016 - 08:31 PM

Damn so with two Wally's the real Bart is never coming back.
:(

Edited by Johnny Here, 21 May 2016 - 08:31 PM.


#26 D Immortalis

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Posted 22 May 2016 - 02:37 AM

oh DC...i wanna wait to reserve judgment till ive read the book...but urge to opinion rising...

 

so the hand ISNT the guy from multiversity? why is it that DC just cannot WAIT to ignore and ruin Multiversity as much as possible? First the Anti-Monitor thing and now the hand...both things from Geoff Johns stories...what does he have against Morrison?

 

sigh...even the JSA thing bothers me...i know i shouldnt care, but Johnny Thunders was dead, and living in the fifth dimension...i hope this "return" doesnt suck.


_+-=-+DAEMON IMMORTALIS+-=-+_

I see behind a thousand lies that you try to hide

I bleed inside: you left your knife but I'm still alive
I...love the way you kill me
I love the way you watch me die

Life or death a bullet to the chest
I'd do it again...
Just when I think I've cut you out
You come with open arms to drag me down


#27 Internet Jesus

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Posted 22 May 2016 - 05:25 AM

The problem with Multiversity and Darkseid War was the timing. At first, the Pandora thing with Wildstorm, DC and Vertigo merging was supposed to lead into Darkseid War, and the eventual move of the DC offices from New York to Burbank.

 

But timing fell through. Multiversity was going to be the reason for the New 52, but it didn't happen there either. That's two events wasted. Then there was Convergence but that's a whole different mess.

 

So Johns did this to lead into Rebirth instead. I have no idea why they cant just let Grant do what he wants, but these are the cards we've been dealt. An evil Doctor Manhattan for some reason.


But in the current, digitized world, trivial information is accumulating every second, preserved in all its triteness. Never fading, always accessible. Rumors about petty issues, misinterpretations, slander... All this junk data preserved in an unfiltered state, growing at an alarming rate. It will only slow down social progress, reduce the rate of evolution. You seem to think that our plan is one of censorship. What we propose to do is not to control content, but to create context.


#28 Ramsay Lokos

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Posted 22 May 2016 - 06:56 AM

I barely follow comic stories these days, but I don't see this as a problem as long as the stories are good. I have no loyalty towards one writer or another, regardless of the high esteem people have towards them. I DO like the supposed goal to return to a brighter, more optimistic DC Universe. That was one of the more defining differences between them and Marvel's more sober approach to comic stories. I may end up picking up some titles from DC after Wednesday if they can execute their plans well. Isn't that the goal?

#29 Confuzor

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Posted 22 May 2016 - 10:44 AM

No. It ends with the guy reaching into a pile of stuff to possibly publish and pulling out the journal. When the journal is read the secret of what happened is out. How the reader, and the world react to that is left entirely open.

It could be dismissed as 9/11 ish crackpot conspiracy or it could absolutely destroy everything Ozmandias did. Watchman makes no hint it just ends with it being found and about to be read and the secret will be out.

-ZacWilliam, so we're left 50/50 on the world falling apart again.


Its been a while since I read Watchmen, but wasn't it pointed out at one time that whatever Rorschach was "writing" was really just illegible scrawls on the paper? The guy who opens the book is going to see the fevered chickenscratch of a lunatic and toss it aside.

#30 Fero McPigletron

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Posted 22 May 2016 - 10:49 AM

Legion hints? But not the Zero Hour kid legion (grown up now I suppose)? Boo. Where's Gates?

FWXOT0z.gif

   TOY DRAMA THEATER!

1 minute of (minimal) lights, (steady) camera and...  ACTION FIGURES! (mostly Transformers) - Episode 031: Combiners and chest envy 

Episodes here


#31 Sean Whitmore

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Posted 22 May 2016 - 04:14 PM

Thankfully, I'm emotionally divorced enough now from the current DCU that I can just sort of observe the trainwreckiness of it all from afar.

 

I hope DC sends the leaker a nice fruit basket, cause this is gonna sell copies of the book to people who otherwise didn't give a damn about another tired event comic.


PSN: SeanWhitmore

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I did a new video thing:
https://www.allspark.com/forums/topic/159447-whos-the-right-arm/
And a fic thing:
https://www.allspark.com/forums/topic/169332-do-no-harm-first-aid/


#32 Dusty

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Posted 25 May 2016 - 12:44 PM

I stopped reading DC monthlies not long after the New 52 happened. I am deathly tired of reboots and "edginess" for the sake of goosing sales.

 

DC Rebirth is a fantastic comic. It's the first time I've been interested in DC's mainline books in years. You should actually read it, rather than a bullet point list of spoilers, before you judge it too harshly. It's very, very good.


  • Jet likes this

#33 D Immortalis

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Posted 25 May 2016 - 01:36 PM

​Being a DC guy at heart, I was let down by a lot of the new52, though, yes, there was some good, and even great stuff in there. My big problem with current DC is the lack of a coherent continuity. This mostly stems around The post Convergence stuff, Darkseid War, Batman #50, and Green Lantern...but I'm just one of those guys who likes to know when stuff happens in relation to other stuff, I'm crazy like that.

 

REBIRTH was FANTASTIC! If this is setting the stage for all that's to come from DC for a while, I'm so on board. While theyre not erasing the new52, they are . making enough changes to it that I look forward to seeing what "matters" from here on out. It feels like theres been an addition of hope into the dark and griminess of the new52, and that's really what it needed more than anything.

 

And random appearance by what appears to be a pre-Flashpoint Captain Atom made me happy, its always good to see him (funny to include him considering the rest of the issue)...and is the girl in the blue cloak with Starfire suppoused to be Raven?

 

Just as the universe got a shot of hope, I have too.

 

Also, Superman #52 totally brought a tear to my eye. I didn't like new52 supes until the powerloss stoyline began...its been rock solid great since then.

 

Please, please don't screw this up guys, please.


Edited by D Immortalis, 25 May 2016 - 01:40 PM.

_+-=-+DAEMON IMMORTALIS+-=-+_

I see behind a thousand lies that you try to hide

I bleed inside: you left your knife but I'm still alive
I...love the way you kill me
I love the way you watch me die

Life or death a bullet to the chest
I'd do it again...
Just when I think I've cut you out
You come with open arms to drag me down


#34 Destron D-69

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Posted 25 May 2016 - 01:46 PM

well I'm dropping my last DC book with issue 52 of Batgirl... seems fitting



#35 Internet Jesus

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Posted 25 May 2016 - 01:48 PM

Oh, you're gonna hate it when they reveal New 52 Superman was either Kon-El all along or a genetic clone like Bubastis was.

 

Because the guy who was manipulating New 52 Supes? He's called Mr. Oz. He just appeared to Pre-52 Supes in Rebirth.

 

Mr. Oz.

 

Oz.

 

Ozymandias.

 

Bubastis connection.

 

Bam.


But in the current, digitized world, trivial information is accumulating every second, preserved in all its triteness. Never fading, always accessible. Rumors about petty issues, misinterpretations, slander... All this junk data preserved in an unfiltered state, growing at an alarming rate. It will only slow down social progress, reduce the rate of evolution. You seem to think that our plan is one of censorship. What we propose to do is not to control content, but to create context.


#36 AgentOrange

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Posted 25 May 2016 - 02:23 PM

Oh, you're gonna hate it when they reveal New 52 Superman was either Kon-El all along or a genetic clone like Bubastis was.

 

Because the guy who was manipulating New 52 Supes? He's called Mr. Oz. He just appeared to Pre-52 Supes in Rebirth.

 

Mr. Oz.

 

Oz.

 

Ozymandias.

 

Bubastis connection.

 

Bam.

 

You wait for dead52 Clark to have actually been Superboy Prime plucked from the Source Wall by Manhattan and you'll wish that was the case.


You may be a lover but you ain't no dancer

#37 Cattleprod

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Posted 25 May 2016 - 03:11 PM

Okay, the explanation for how two Wally Wests exist in the New 52 universe actively makes no sense if you've actually followed the New 52 Flash comics. The original ginger Wally says he's the son of Rudy West, and everyone just forgot he existed, and the new Wally is the son of Daniel West, the first New 52 Reverse Flash. Except... new Wally was the son of Rudy West. They specifically established that Daniel was his uncle, and also, Daniel would've been 10 years old when new Wally was born.



#38 Jet

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Posted 25 May 2016 - 03:12 PM

Obviously the three Jokers are Batman '66 Joker, BTAS Joker, and TDK Joker.

That would seriously be the greatest thing ever.


D&D has to report to shareholders. Pathfinder only has to impress its neckbeards.


#39 Dusty

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Posted 25 May 2016 - 03:13 PM

Okay, the explanation for how two Wally Wests exist in the New 52 universe actively makes no sense if you've actually followed the New 52 Flash comics.

 

Don't worry, nobody has.



#40 D Immortalis

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Posted 25 May 2016 - 04:55 PM

Oh, you're gonna hate it when they reveal New 52 Superman was either Kon-El all along or a genetic clone like Bubastis was.

 

Because the guy who was manipulating New 52 Supes? He's called Mr. Oz. He just appeared to Pre-52 Supes in Rebirth.

 

Mr. Oz.

 

Oz.

 

Ozymandias.

 

Bubastis connection.

 

Bam.

Half-Life 3 confirmed?

 

or

 

It was ME Austin! It Was me All along!


Edited by D Immortalis, 25 May 2016 - 04:55 PM.

_+-=-+DAEMON IMMORTALIS+-=-+_

I see behind a thousand lies that you try to hide

I bleed inside: you left your knife but I'm still alive
I...love the way you kill me
I love the way you watch me die

Life or death a bullet to the chest
I'd do it again...
Just when I think I've cut you out
You come with open arms to drag me down




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