The Transformers: The Movie (1986) minus Unicron?

Tuxedo Prime

Well-known member
Citizen
Everyone talks like it's the shot that killed Brawn, and not maybe being on board the exploding space shuttle that crashed into the countryside.
I did mention a second bout of extended stasis lock... history rhyming and all that. 😉

Of course, David Willis was known to insist back on ATT of yore that after Hot Rod stopped shooting at said shuttle, Brawn guided it to a landing on top of Predaking -- which is why the team's debut was pushed back from The Animated Movie to the last episode of Five Faces of Darkness : it took them that long to recover! 😆
 

Haywire

Collecter of Gobots and Godzilla
Citizen
RE: Brawn:
download.jpeg


As far as Unicron goes, if he hadn't been in the movie, the Nazis would have gotten the amulet from Marion, found the Ark in the Well of Souls, taken it to their secret island, and Belloq, in his hubris, would have opened it and all the Nazis would have died anyway. So, clearly, Unicron was irrelevant to the plot of the movie...
 

KingSwoop

Member
Citizen
I think it's important to note that Transformers don't die of injuries in the movie, (hang on, hear me out) they die because the plot requires them too and the circumstances around those deaths seem wildly inconsistent.

Like, Brawn, one of the tougher Autobots, dies to a shot to shoulder while Ironhide gets shot multiple times in his chest and still manages to crawl over to Megatron in a futile attempt to stop him, meanwhile getting attacked like that took out Prowl and Ratchet. Meanwhile, as has been noted a million times before, Optimus Prime dies from a couple of attacks to his side abdominal, while Ultra Magnus literally gets blown to pieces and is managed to be repaired.

Thematically, it makes sense for Megatron to die without even being able to enjoy the fact that he finally took out Prime, consumed by the evil he surrounded himself by.

And obviously, when the Quintesson brings back Optimus Prime for real, Megatron probably wouldn't be too far behind.
G1 transformers biology was still in development through Beast Wars (and arguably IDW).

I'll agree that there were plot reasons why characters died in the movie, but we can explain this in-universe; the Decepticons have better/fully charged weapons... and less reason to take prisoners. On Earth, it was always kind of a up in the air when you'd recharge... and you could argue Megatron was seeking to dominate the autobots (and maybe robosmash them eventually? Think Beast Wars shell program...); but in the movie, Megatron's out to end the war for good; at this point the autobots are a real threat due to their supply of energon, alliance with Earth, and two moon bases full of weapons ready to start an invasion. Kid gloves are off.

You seem to be approaching this question from a narrative one, but I'm trying to approach it from something of an alternative history perspective. If there was no Unicron, how would things have panned out?

Of course it's possible Megatron was pulled into a black hole, or died of a coolant leak, or whatever... but I'd like to think Shockwave or somebody might have gone behind Starscream's back and looked for his body to revive him. Starscream's just not that good of a leader, and someone's going to want to bring back Megatron. The big question, then, is whether Megatron pulls a Galvatron and blows up Starscream, or whether he continues to cultivate the duplicity and treachery that serve as the foundation of Beast Wars' Predacon honor?

I think what would happen is:
Megatron with the other barely alive cons just drift across the stars falling into stasis lock until they crash land somewhere, likely Junkion, where the cons sort of become apart of Junkion with Megatron getting rebuilt as a more powerful verison of himself, but no clue how to get off Junkion as he likely takes parts for the Junkion ship without realising its a ship, after all, he is looking at junk in his optics

On Cybertron, after time of calm, Starscream launches a disasterious attack on the Autobot Moon bases, as he sees them as the biggest threat to controlling Cybertron, after a forced retreat as the Autobots from Earth have arrived to take command, of the battle, the Decepticons would start fighting among themselves again and likely spiltner into multable factions...

Megatron landing on Junkion could work; I don't know if the Junkions would repair them... unless he pretended to be a victim, which he might. But if he's a victim, he might just ask for a ship, and they might send a crew to drive him home, a crew he might kill to steal the ship... but honestly, it's not that good of a ship, so maybe he just gets back to Cybertron and beats the snot out of Starscream?

That said, I like the idea that the 'cons give way to infighting when there's no serious autobot threat (see Marvel comics in the US & UK on Cybertron), but when the autobots have moon bases, I think an assassination is more likely than a Decepticon Civil War.

Would Starscream launch an attack on the moon bases? Sure! But as I noted earlier, I think there's a good chance that at least one of those is designed to fail to get rid of those who might betray him. But the fact remains that IF he can't destroy the moon bases, whether because he's a fool or because he's done the math, I think he might opt for a truce... if only to look for an opportunity to backstab the autobots. Whether this is before the invasion or after is a fair question.

In fact, here's a thought - Would Starscream offer the autobots their home city of Iacon to sweeten the deal? "Hey, that war? All Megatron's doing. How 'bout you come home, to Iacon, and we work together to restore Cybertron?" Remember, Cybertron's been a war zone devoid of natural resources due to the war; but a truce with the autobots could bring exported Earth energon to Cybertron... and give the 'cons the resources to fortify their positions...
 
Last edited:

CoffeeHorse

*sip*
Staff member
Council of Elders
Citizen
the Decepticons have better/fully charged weapons... and less reason to take prisoners. On Earth, it was always kind of a up in the air when you'd recharge

Also, right when they were first starting to make some progress making energon on Earth, Starscream immediately wasted their supply. If the Decepticons are like any organization I've ever seen, the whole army soon got a memo that they would have tighter limits on their energon usage going forward.
 

Superomegaprime

Wondering bot
Citizen
When I wrote my view, I was more thinking along the lines of what I gaged from the movie, in Starscream's mind, the real threat was the Autobots moon bases while Megatron wanted to cut off their energon stocks, and then attack the moon bases, likely his plan was to not only slip pass their early warning systems but land safely and launch the surprise attack, if not for Daniel & Hot Rod, they would of likely suceeded. The whole internal fighting thing, has been apart of G1 outside of Starscream we had triple changers trying to become leaders and we saw when Megatron was out of the way, the cons battling to be leader inside of Astrotrain and my guess is, they came to an agreement that Starscream should lead for now and I believe he would launch a full scale attack on the moonbases, but the Autobots would have the advatange of knowing the lay out and not having to use a lot of energon to get from the moons to Cybertron, thus they would have a lot going for them and reinforcements from Earth would help!

As for Megatron & the Junkions, the Junkions at first were hostile but it was Hot Rod using the Universal greeting and the energon goodie that enabled them to become friends, we know Megatron was tossed out into space by Starscream and I believe he would of drifted to Junkion in the end as all space junk ends up there and a junkion mistakes him for another junkion who might of been just born and needing parts to become operational again, after all, their culture is centred around junk and TV! The only con that we have to try and guess what they would do in this, is Shockwave, his only appearance that was speaking was telling the cons to scramble, before he got crushed by Unicron's hand and he was apointed by Megatron as the guardian of Cybertron, some 4 million years prior and I would like to think, he would not only kept energon stocks hidden from Starscream, he likely let the most foolish ones follow his folly/gamble to attack the moons, thus not all of the Decepticon forces would go, likely during the 4 million years, a lot of Decepticons chosen to follow Shockwave as he did not disappear off into space!
 

KingSwoop

Member
Citizen
Also, right when they were first starting to make some progress making energon on Earth, Starscream immediately wasted their supply. If the Decepticons are like any organization I've ever seen, the whole army soon got a memo that they would have tighter limits on their energon usage going forward.
Offering an in-universe explanation for why the military coup faction started shooting to kill is always going to be an uphill battle.

That said, I'd like to think that there's more to it; every time we saw Cybertron in S1-S2, it was ghost world, practically unchanged for millions of years, with only a handful of local inhabitants at any given time. While it's never been clear how easy it was to create new transformers (without "supernatural" aid like Vector Sigma), the extinction of the race was certainly a reasonable fear on both sides. (In MTMTE, when asked whether Cybertron still exists after so much time, Megatron says "it must"... but whether this was faith or wishful thinking is up for interpretation.)

It's possible that after Megatron's return and relatively steady supply of energon that things "got better" on Cybertron, at least in the Decepticon capital city, leading to an influx of Cybertronians - whether revived from stasis, returning from space (a la IDW), new robots, or something else is up for debate.

Thus I'd LIKE to think that for all his bravado, Megatron didn't really want to kill the autobots, but conquer them; they're his civilian workforce after all. But by the time of the movie, the autobots' compassion and heroism had lead to them becoming a military threat. That, combined with a stable cybertronian population, means the kid gloves are off.

When I wrote my view, I was more thinking along the lines of what I gaged from the movie, in Starscream's mind, the real threat was the Autobots moon bases while Megatron wanted to cut off their energon stocks, and then attack the moon bases, likely his plan was to not only slip pass their early warning systems but land safely and launch the surprise attack, if not for Daniel & Hot Rod, they would of likely suceeded. The whole internal fighting thing, has been apart of G1 outside of Starscream we had triple changers trying to become leaders and we saw when Megatron was out of the way, the cons battling to be leader inside of Astrotrain and my guess is, they came to an agreement that Starscream should lead for now and I believe he would launch a full scale attack on the moonbases, but the Autobots would have the advatange of knowing the lay out and not having to use a lot of energon to get from the moons to Cybertron, thus they would have a lot going for them and reinforcements from Earth would help!
In universe, I think there's an argument that there was a parallel battle happening at the Ark with the S2 characters not featured in the movie; a distraction that occurred about the same time as the battle for autobot city; making this part of a 2-progned attack on the Autobot's Earth strongholds. If they could make Earth unsafe for the autobots, then it's possible Megatron could steal enough energon to put up a much bigger fight on Cybertron, while splitting the autobot's focus.

Also, it's hard to take Starscream's criticism seriously; he likes to poke the bear. Of course the lethal weapons on Cybertron's doorstep are a greater threat to Cybertron than Autobot City on EARTH... but Autobot City is where they're getting energon from for the attack; cut the energon supply, no attack.

As for bickering over who is the leader, I think you're underestimating the scale of the threat. Either Starscream wins, at which point assassination is on the table, or he loses, and he's removed from power. Fighting about who gets to wear the crown is a bit meaningless; ESPECIALLY since the movie tells us who wins (and that isn't changed by removing Unicron).

As for Megatron & the Junkions, the Junkions at first were hostile but it was Hot Rod using the Universal greeting and the energon goodie that enabled them to become friends, we know Megatron was tossed out into space by Starscream and I believe he would of drifted to Junkion in the end as all space junk ends up there and a junkion mistakes him for another junkion who might of been just born and needing parts to become operational again, after all, their culture is centred around junk and TV! The only con that we have to try and guess what they would do in this, is Shockwave, his only appearance that was speaking was telling the cons to scramble, before he got crushed by Unicron's hand and he was apointed by Megatron as the guardian of Cybertron, some 4 million years prior and I would like to think, he would not only kept energon stocks hidden from Starscream, he likely let the most foolish ones follow his folly/gamble to attack the moons, thus not all of the Decepticon forces would go, likely during the 4 million years, a lot of Decepticons chosen to follow Shockwave as he did not disappear off into space!

Here's the thing: Space is BIG. The idea that Megatron would crash land on a planet (non-fatally), let alone one with Cybertronians, within a few weeks is statistically unlikely. With that in mind, I think it's far more likely that Shockwave or Soundwave might fly out to pick him up when they get a chance, and that chance is probably statistically well before he hits a planet.

That said, if the question is "What if a critically injured Megatron crashlands on the Planet of Junk?" I think you're right, without Soundwave (or some ad hoc IDW-esque character development of Thundercracker), Megatron's going to be surrounded by the Junkions. But I don't think they're going to just KILL the trespassers; maybe Megatron puts up a fight, but for all we know once he's passed out, Wreck Garr's crew could stabilize his position. At this point, we can extrapolate what G1 Megatron might do; think he initially reacted to Skyfire; I don't see Wreck Garr being opposed to repairing their visitors and sending them on their way... although, perhaps, without their weapons. The question, then, becomes whether Megatron can slick talk him into getting his weapons back (or turns into a gun for Thundercracker to hold, to shoot his way out of things?).

Re: Shockwave - We've actually seen how he reacts to Starscream in the show; it's possible that he's feigning loyalty here (although, was he even at the ceremony?). In any case, I can't see Shockwave openly defying Starscream in a state of emergency like this; maybe he slips off to look for Megatron, but as you say, he does have his duties, and those are even more important given Starscream's putting his charge at risk.
 
Last edited:

Sabrblade

Continuity Nutcase
Citizen
Also, right when they were first starting to make some progress making energon on Earth, Starscream immediately wasted their supply. If the Decepticons are like any organization I've ever seen, the whole army soon got a memo that they would have tighter limits on their energon usage going forward.
I dunno. Megatron had a bad habit of creating and establishing many superfluous bases on Earth that were only ever once and never used again. There were at least five of them seen throughout season 2. That sounds like a major waste of resources.
 


Top Bottom