THE KNOCK OFF TRANSFORMERS THREAD

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PrimalxConvoy

NOT a New Member.
Citizen
textprome_1610f75011f8e4.jpgWelcome to the Allspark's thread for all things Knockoff, 4P, KO, Bootleg and other non-official and non "third party" TFs.

Please feel free to post sightings, share news or chew the cud about this underground and (sometimes misunderstood) part of TF culture. To start the ball rolling, here are some resource links below to KO TFs and the wider world of knockoffs in general.

(Note: Some sections have been put behind "Spoiler" tags in order to limit the post length/create a neater appearance)

General KO Info
Tfwiki's (slightly outdated) article on KO TFs
- https://tfwiki.net/wiki/Knockoff

Teletran1's (equally outdated and possibly erroneous) article on KO TFs
- https://transformers.fandom.com/wiki/Knockoff

A Brief History of KO G1 TFs
- https://youtu.be/Uz-mr8DkP40

The Legal Definitions & Issues Relating to KOs and Counterfeit Goods

"...the differences [between a knock-off and a counterfeit], a knockoff is just that: a cheap imitation. While the original manufacturer may not be happy about someone mimicking their design for a quick buck, it is generally not clearly illegal. As such, the buyer has little to worry about, and if they get tired of the item and decide to resell it, they will probably not have law enforcement kicking down their door..."

(Source: - https://www.hg.org/legal-articles/c...er-goods-is-it-illegal-to-purchase-them-31573 )


"...The colloquial term knockoff is often used interchangeably with counterfeit, although their legal meanings are not identical. Knockoff products are those that copy or imitate the physical appearance of other products but which do not copy the brand name or logo of a trademark. They may still be illegal under trademark laws if they confuse consumers. Counterfeiters can include producers, distributors or retail sellers. Pirated goods are reproductions of copyrighted products used without permission, such as music, movies or ssoftware Exact definitions depend on the laws of various countries..."

(Source: - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterfeit_consumer_goods )

More Legal Info & Discussion Relating to KOs.
The difference between a knockoff and a counterfeit product - https://ezinearticles.com/?What-Is-the-Difference-Between-a-Counterfeit-and-a-Knockoff?&id=7095554

Definition of "counterfeit'
- https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterfeit

Here's a review of a possibly counterfeit G1 TF:
- https://youtu.be/zuTvWteX6UU

Hasbro vs Sparkletoys Lawsuit (which was mentioned in one of the videos above)
- https://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/F2/780/189/148570/

Transformers Rubsigns (Legal Protection Against Counterfeits)
- http://www.jaredunzipped.com/2016/03/how-do-transformers-rubsign-stickers.html?m=1

Ragdoll vs Wallmart's KO Teletubbies:
- https://www.nytimes.com/1999/03/23/...ubbies-as-cute-winds-up-in-federal-court.html

Official Hasbro Rubsign Advert
- https://youtu.be/EjvgH3ueXkg More Info on Rubsigns - https://youtu.be/MvyIFbtHTos

When a KO is not a KO
- https://arstechnica.com/cars/2021/05/when-is-a-porsche-911-not-a-porsche-911-when-its-a-ruf/

Why KOs are basically legal
-

When KOs are better than the originals
-

Everyday Items We Buy That Are KOs

Supermarket/Food KOs:

- https://www.thetravel.com/knockoff-food-brands-surprising/

- https://www.forbes.com/sites/lauraheller/2011/06/29/10-secrets-about-store-brands/?sh=1119b08f7db0
- https://joyenergizer.com/30-hilarious-aldi-lidl-knock-offs-famous-brands/

Screenshot_20220911-165310.jpg
(Notice the similar packaging designs for similar products)

- A Comparison of Store Brand and Regular Brand Supermarket Packaging:
- https://www.stat.berkeley.edu/~aldous/Research/Ugrad/Jane_Liang.pdf

Name brands vs. knockoffs: Putting food to the test.

https://www.click2houston.com/consumer/2018/02/19/name-brands-vs-knockoffs-putting-food-to-the-test/

Name Brands vs. Knockoffs: What to never buy generic:
- https://www.click2houston.com/consu...rands-vs-knockoffs-what-to-never-buy-generic/

Information about "private label/store brand" products:
- https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_label

Knockoff Store-Brand Colas & Coca-Cola (Similar Packaging).jpg
(Notice the similar packaging and products)

BETTER THAN REAL THING.These supermarket colas cost a fraction of the top brands:

- https://www.thesun.co.uk/money/18625519/aldi-morrisons-tesco-lidl-asda-sainsburys-colas-tested/

Coca Cola & Sainsburys Supermarket Knockoff Classic Cola Packaging.jpg
Sainsbury gives in to Coke: Retailer will change design of its own-brand cola cans after 'amicable discussions'

"COCA-COLA...persuaded J Sainsbury to change the design of its own-brand 'Classic' cola to make it look less like Coke...

.. it had carried out research that showed customers were confused about which was Coke and which was Sainsbury's Classic. 'The new version is a signifcant improvement which has addressed our main concerns...Sainsbury is changing the typeface and removing underlining from part of the logo on the can...

Many other producers have claimed that retailers' brand packaging is so similar to their own that it is virtually indistinguishable, but this is the first significant victory for the manufacturers in this area.

Several leading branded goods manufacturers - including Unilever, Allied-Lyons, Kellogs and Mars - are attempting to persuade the Government to tackle the problem of copycat brands in a review of trade mark legislation currently going though Parliament..."


(Source: - https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-cans-after-amicable-discussions-1435187.html )

Americans are ditching knock-off brands: Pampers and Hefty are back:
-

Knockoff Groceries:
- https://www.grocerydive.com/news/gr...uts-inside-krogers-private-label-push/534196/

Is AI-Generated Art a Knockoff?

- https://arstechnica.com/information...ges-some-art-communities-ban-them-completely/

FDA Lets Pharmacies Substitute Branded Insulin With Knockoff Product:

- https://www.wsj.com/articles/fda-le...duct-in-first-for-a-biologic-drug-11627589200

The Rise of Big Generic: Why Knockoff Prescriptions Now Cost $1,200:

- https://truthout.org/articles/the-rise-of-big-generic-why-knockoff-prescriptions-now-cost-1-200/

Generic Medicine Information:

- https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generic_drug

Everyday Clothing Which are Knockoffs

How Fast Fashion Brands Get Away With Copying Designers

"...Fast fashion retailers like Zara and H&M are able to produce and sell garments that look almost exactly the same as designs by luxury labels because “Essentially, in the U.S., we don’t have copyright protection for fashion design,” Borukhovich said. Additionally, copyright law “does not provide exclusive rights for inherently useful items,” Zerbo said. Garments and accessories are typically considered “useful items,” she added, because bags allow us to carry things and dresses cover our bodies..."

(Source: - https://www.huffpost.com/entry/fast-fashion-copycats_n_5b8967f9e4b0511db3d7def6 )

Knockoff Designer Clothing (which is perfectly legal) :
- https://the-socialites-closet.com/knock-off-clothing/

Highstreet Shops' Fashion Knockoffs:
- https://www.wmagazine.com/gallery/most-shameless-high-fashion-knockoffs-2017

High street hijack: Those cut-price copies of designer outfits:
- https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/...-Those-cut-price-copies-designer-outfits.html

How Legit Companies (Including Hasbro) Circumvent Copyright (or Related) Laws

Hasbro/Takara Tomy's "Knockoff Vehicle" Transformers?
[- https://tfwiki.net/wiki/Licensed_vehicle_alternate_modes
Unlicensed KO Vehicle Mode Examples (made by Hasbro).png

Kre-o - Hasbro's Knockoff Lego?
- https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2011...s-kre-o-transformer-kits-dont-call-them-lego/

More info on "Lego Clone" products:
- https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lego_clone

A comedy video about "knockoff" Kre-o vs Lego:

- https://youtu.be/vv3srTr9ZhQ

Hasbro's Official TF Knockoff, "Jetfire"
-
- https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment...con-exclusive-transformers-toy-050000667.html

- https://tfwiki.net/wiki/Jetfire_(G1)/toys (See the "notes" section, at the bottom of the link's page)

Grey/Parallel Market Imported Products
- https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey_market

- https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_import

-
(Deals with issues, such as potentially lost sales of American products, by purchasing products imported from outside America instead, similar to buying imported Takara/Hasbro Asia TFs instead of Hasbro TFs in America. This is an oft-quoted argument against buying KO TFs too.)

Knockoff TF Manufacturer "Weijiang" "Closed" by Hasbro?

- https://www.shine.cn/news/metro/2007232766/

How Companies Circumvent the Law to a Avoid Tarifs
-

Personal Opinions and Discussions of KO TFs
A video about the current (2022) state of KO MP TFs, plus some opinions as to why the uploader believes KO TFs are a good thing
- https://youtu.be/7uVWQCEZCSI

A Brief Discussion at Seibertron.com (in defense of KOs)
- https://www.seibertron.com/energonp...n-customizations-forum--p2126469.php#p2126449

Comedy Sketch About Chinese KOs
- https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UCzMY8JepF8&feature=youtu.be

Knockoff TF Video Resources (Reviews, etc)

KO Transformers Online Shops
ShowZ Store
- https://showzstore.com/c/4th-party-tfs_0373

(ShowZ's Discord also has sections for (KO) TF discussion - https://discord.gg/eTJfsjH6MB )

TF Direct
- https://tf-direct.com/

Sirtoys
- http://sirtoys.com/
 
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PrimalxConvoy

NOT a New Member.
Citizen
More KOs

KO MP Optimus Prime.pngshunqirun jets and tanks.jpgB_2021519454801.jpg39-25.jpgIMG20210902100824_Bumblebee_Movie_OS_BM_28cm_V2_Blue.jpg

(Note: - Original info lost, due to bugs in the Allspark's post editing tools on mobile).
 
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Dvandom

Well-known member
Citizen
Ollie's currently has a rather large motorcycle-to-robot that appears to be an oversized knockoff of a Roadbot (I never got the Roadbots motorcycles, but it has the usual design elements). The motorcycle mode is about 1:8 or 1:6 scale, and the toy is $13-14.

---Dave
 

PrimalxConvoy

NOT a New Member.
Citizen
Ollie's currently has a rather large motorcycle-to-robot that appears to be an oversized knockoff of a Roadbot (I never got the Roadbots motorcycles, but it has the usual design elements). The motorcycle mode is about 1:8 or 1:6 scale, and the toy is $13-14.

---Dave
Nice! Any pictures?
 

Dvandom

Well-known member
Citizen
Haven't gotten around to opening it yet. (My free time kinda fell into the black hole of "Inspired to write an entire TTRPG" last week.) I'll take pics once I do, and post them here.

ETA: Okay, it's made by Happywell, so it's not actually a Roadbots KO...just a different brand name, I guess. (Happywell made Roadbots too.)

---Dave
 
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PrimalxConvoy

NOT a New Member.
Citizen
Haven't gotten around to opening it yet. (My free time kinda fell into the black hole of "Inspired to write an entire TTRPG" last week.) I'll take pics once I do, and post them here.

---Dave
Looking forward to them! Cheers!
 

Dvandom

Well-known member
Citizen
XBotHarley1.JPG
Transformation is far from perfect. A lot of places it felt like it was going to break, a fair amount of partforming, and you have to split the "trunk" in two along a seam, which feels like breaking it open entirely.

XBotHarley3.JPG
Transformed and next to Voyager Wreck-Gar for comparison. Negligible articulation, nowhere to stick the shield chunks if you want to use the pistols that are under the windshield.

XBotHarley2.JPG
The highly optimistic and flattering-camera-angle pics from the box.

---Dave
 

Dvandom

Well-known member
Citizen
Other notes: the tires are rubber and spin nicely. The kickstand is messed up in some way and the cycle falls over. It has Harley Davidson logos on it, may even be licensed, but there's no text to that effect on the package or in the (black and white line-art) instructions.

---Dave
 

PrimalxConvoy

NOT a New Member.
Citizen
View attachment 224
Transformation is far from perfect. A lot of places it felt like it was going to break, a fair amount of partforming, and you have to split the "trunk" in two along a seam, which feels like breaking it open entirely.

View attachment 225
Transformed and next to Voyager Wreck-Gar for comparison. Negligible articulation, nowhere to stick the shield chunks if you want to use the pistols that are under the windshield.

View attachment 226
The highly optimistic and flattering-camera-angle pics from the box.

---Dave
Nice! Thanks for sharing! Does it scale well with existing TFs?

Also, I just saw these OSKO Botbots available:

-

Here's a link to them at Sirtoys:

- http://sirtoys.com/toys.php?q=Botbots

Sirtoys has also got a similarly styled (KO) "Hamburger Train Robot Combiner":

- http://sirtoys.com/toys.php?c=11&p=7011&t=Hamburg_Train_Robot.html
IMG20210908075301_sirtoys.jpg
 
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