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Hasbro Brand Panel - 3pm CDT


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#481 Master Fwiffo

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 03:55 PM

I have a question. For the whole 'Parents can't tell dinosaurs apart which is why we can't have Dinobots' crowd, and for Hasbro which touts the same reasoning.


Wave 1 of Prime RID has 3 Sportscars (Cliffjumper, Bumblebee, Wheeljack). Over the course of the next 4 waves, we'll be adding another 4 to those. (Vehicon, Hot Shot, Repaint Bumblebee, Dead End. 5 If Rumble is in there).

Why is it impossible to have 5 dinobots, but ok to have 7 sportscars?


(PS: I am officially sick of sport car Transformers. I want an old junker damnit. Or a mom-mobile Station Wagon.)

Edited by Master Fwiffo, 08 May 2012 - 03:56 PM.


#482 Daytonus

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 03:59 PM

These last couple of posts are basically, in a nutshell, what I have been trying to say. The constraints on buying toys are really different both over time and in different children's and parents' experiences depending on social and economic factors, so anything that is deemed to lower psychological barriers for purchase is going to probably be the likely marketing decision. The worst thing we can do in terms of understanding the market is to project our expertise and what we deem as "common sense" onto other people, especially in the face of evidence that those same things are not common sense to other people.

#483 ZacWilliam1

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 03:59 PM

QUOTE(Master Fwiffo @ May 8 2012, 04:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
(PS: I am officially sick of sport car Transformers. I want an old junker damnit. Or a mom-mobile Station Wagon.)


I'm still pulling for a schoolbus someday. Can't believe we never got one in G1.


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#484 Daytonus

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 04:11 PM

QUOTE(Master Fwiffo @ May 8 2012, 04:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I have a question. For the whole 'Parents can't tell dinosaurs apart which is why we can't have Dinobots' crowd, and for Hasbro which touts the same reasoning.


Wave 1 of Prime RID has 3 Sportscars (Cliffjumper, Bumblebee, Wheeljack). Over the course of the next 4 waves, we'll be adding another 4 to those. (Vehicon, Hot Shot, Repaint Bumblebee, Dead End. 5 If Rumble is in there).

Why is it impossible to have 5 dinobots, but ok to have 7 sportscars?


(PS: I am officially sick of sport car Transformers. I want an old junker damnit. Or a mom-mobile Station Wagon.)


Simply, Hasbro has spent considerable capital on building in the public zeitgeist the knowledge of that difference. Bumblebee is, in people's minds, SPECIFICALLY a yellow sports car. The others, while getting less screen time, are still clearly indicated as different characters. Bumblebee is not a Vehicon. That is obvious. Grimlock is not Snarl? Not obvious for the average person. Perhaps after FOC...we'll have to see.

For the past decade, Hasbro has chosen not to maintain that amount of public knowledge for the Dinobots. It's not in their game plan. None of the groups have really gotten that kind of treatment except maybe the Constructicons, and we didn't even get all of them in the movie series except as Legends. That's why Bruticus is a long shot for them. It's riding on the predicted strength of Bruticus as a pop culture icon when FOC hits.

So, yeah, the Dinobots may perhaps get the same treatment if FOC gets really popular. We know there's a Grimlock coming, but he's likely to be the Dinobot stand-in unless there's some clamor for the Dinobots as individuals.

#485 mx-01 archon

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 04:19 PM

QUOTE(Master Fwiffo @ May 8 2012, 01:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I have a question. For the whole 'Parents can't tell dinosaurs apart which is why we can't have Dinobots' crowd, and for Hasbro which touts the same reasoning.


Wave 1 of Prime RID has 3 Sportscars (Cliffjumper, Bumblebee, Wheeljack). Over the course of the next 4 waves, we'll be adding another 4 to those. (Vehicon, Hot Shot, Repaint Bumblebee, Dead End. 5 If Rumble is in there).

Why is it impossible to have 5 dinobots, but ok to have 7 sportscars?


(PS: I am officially sick of sport car Transformers. I want an old junker damnit. Or a mom-mobile Station Wagon.)


7 cars.

In red, yellow, white with rally deco, deep blue with flames, dark purple, toxic yellow with rally deco, and bright blue. There's also stealth Bumblebee, primarily in black.

That's the reason you can have seven cars over that length of time. They're all immediately distinguishable from each other out of the corner of your eye. They're also spread out over 4-5 waves. And also of differing factions, split 4 to 3 for Autobots and Decepticons.

There's no having to examine the finer details of one grey quadruped vs. another grey quadruped there. In what's actually at retail, you've got a ton of different levels of distinction going for them. There's the immediate colour distinctions, and then if you're a bit more discerning, there's the faction categorizations (depending on a child's play patterns, it can be pretty obvious if he/she prefers good or bad guys, or has desire for one or the other to balance out his teams, or whatever). And then theoretically, all 7-8 figures aren't supposed to be out on the shelf at the same time, so you're really only picking from 2-4.




#486 ▲ndrusi

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 04:28 PM

QUOTE(Master Fwiffo @ May 8 2012, 04:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Wave 1 of Prime RID has 3 Sportscars (Cliffjumper, Bumblebee, Wheeljack). Over the course of the next 4 waves, we'll be adding another 4 to those. (Vehicon, Hot Shot, Repaint Bumblebee, Dead End. 5 If Rumble is in there).

Why is it impossible to have 5 dinobots, but ok to have 7 sportscars?

If those seven cars were all in identical color schemes, you'd have a point.

QUOTE(orionpax44 @ Jun 24 2012, 01:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Childrens toys? whaa the boxes seriously say ages 5+ I consider myself the plus.
QUOTE(mx-01 archon @ Sep 9 2012, 01:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You're talking to ▲ndrusi. Assume everything that he posts is snark.

#487 TrentTroop

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 09:00 PM

QUOTE(Master Fwiffo @ May 8 2012, 03:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I have a question. For the whole 'Parents can't tell dinosaurs apart which is why we can't have Dinobots' crowd, and for Hasbro which touts the same reasoning.


Wave 1 of Prime RID has 3 Sportscars (Cliffjumper, Bumblebee, Wheeljack). Over the course of the next 4 waves, we'll be adding another 4 to those. (Vehicon, Hot Shot, Repaint Bumblebee, Dead End. 5 If Rumble is in there).

Why is it impossible to have 5 dinobots, but ok to have 7 sportscars?


(PS: I am officially sick of sport car Transformers. I want an old junker damnit. Or a mom-mobile Station Wagon.)

This has already been addressed re: the multiple car thing. Basically, toy shelf marketing requires Transformers to be identifiable by the most minimal description, which is the kind of description mom, dad or the grandparents will understand. "I want the yellow car", "want the black helicopter", "I want the red truck" etc. At previous panels, Hasbro has mentioned this as being part of their concern. You're not going to see Sunstreaker and Bumblebee in the same case assortment as they're both "Yellow Cars".

The retail release combaticons are very colorful, just for this reason, I expect.

Now, we might get more hope for multiple dinobots if they were colored like a Sentai Team, say, a Gray Grimlock, Yellow Snarl/Striker, Red Slag/Snarl, Green Sludge and Blue Swoop. Even then, that's a lot of dinosaurs for one assortment with no combining gimmick. I would have no objection to this, since eventually store exclusives could get the classic gray and gold out, and hey, the last two TV shows have had Sentai-Team color-coding for the heroes.

The Insecticons need a similar upgrade, and they probably need to trade in one of their beetles for a Preying Mantis or something akin.

Edited by TrentTroop, 08 May 2012 - 09:01 PM.



#488 Exillion

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 12:40 AM

QUOTE(TrentTroop @ May 8 2012, 07:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Master Fwiffo @ May 8 2012, 03:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I have a question. For the whole 'Parents can't tell dinosaurs apart which is why we can't have Dinobots' crowd, and for Hasbro which touts the same reasoning.


Wave 1 of Prime RID has 3 Sportscars (Cliffjumper, Bumblebee, Wheeljack). Over the course of the next 4 waves, we'll be adding another 4 to those. (Vehicon, Hot Shot, Repaint Bumblebee, Dead End. 5 If Rumble is in there).

Why is it impossible to have 5 dinobots, but ok to have 7 sportscars?


(PS: I am officially sick of sport car Transformers. I want an old junker damnit. Or a mom-mobile Station Wagon.)

This has already been addressed re: the multiple car thing. Basically, toy shelf marketing requires Transformers to be identifiable by the most minimal description, which is the kind of description mom, dad or the grandparents will understand. "I want the yellow car", "want the black helicopter", "I want the red truck" etc. At previous panels, Hasbro has mentioned this as being part of their concern. You're not going to see Sunstreaker and Bumblebee in the same case assortment as they're both "Yellow Cars".

The retail release combaticons are very colorful, just for this reason, I expect.

Now, we might get more hope for multiple dinobots if they were colored like a Sentai Team, say, a Gray Grimlock, Yellow Snarl/Striker, Red Slag/Snarl, Green Sludge and Blue Swoop. Even then, that's a lot of dinosaurs for one assortment with no combining gimmick. I would have no objection to this, since eventually store exclusives could get the classic gray and gold out, and hey, the last two TV shows have had Sentai-Team color-coding for the heroes.

The Insecticons need a similar upgrade, and they probably need to trade in one of their beetles for a Preying Mantis or something akin.


Perhaps we have Grimlock as the mass release with the other Dinobots being released in singles or two-packs as exclusives at different online stores. Both BBTS and Amazon have had store-only exclusives. We also have the Club Store and HasbroToyShop as viable options.

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#489 mx-01 archon

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 02:07 AM

QUOTE(Exillion @ May 8 2012, 10:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Perhaps we have Grimlock as the mass release with the other Dinobots being released in singles or two-packs as exclusives at different online stores. Both BBTS and Amazon have had store-only exclusives. We also have the Club Store and HasbroToyShop as viable options.


Only if the molds are pre-existing. And even then, the numbers game is iffy. Amazon managed to sell through their Unicron stocks pretty fast somehow (but being a bigger retailer probably helped), but BBTS has never had luck with their exclusives, the aforementioned Battle Unicorns and Seacons, which clogged their warehouses for years.

Any singular online merchandiser, especially the Club Store and HTS don't move anywhere near the numbers to finance an entirely new mold.

Heck, BBTS can't even move the numbers required to meet the minimum production order for an assortment of toys that does have the completed tooling (DotM final wave, Prime FE).

Edited by mx-01 archon, 09 May 2012 - 02:09 AM.


#490 Daytonus

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 02:23 AM

I do wonder about a G2-Sentai Team Dinobots at retail and SDCC G1 Dinobots. It'd be a variation on the Bruticus model.

#491 DINOBOT SLUDGE

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 04:34 PM

Seems kind of silly to assume that this dinosaur recognition issue is so complex considering two decades ago Dinobots kept shipping for years due to popularity despite all featuring similar colors (and selling at a higher pricepoint). Then again in Euro Classics and G2.

That is the entire problem with this idea - it has been done before and done very successfully. We are exaggerating a real phenomen to an extent that doesn't exist. I highly doubt parents today have less time for things like looking at two items and noticing they are different. Because they are noticably different. Not at a simple one-second glance, but I think you'd also find market research would tell you people don't just run down an aisle with a cart and flick stuff off the shelf into it as they go.

I'm not sure that characters like Snarl had any more exposure back in the day than he will in FOC. Also, if we are assuming the ineptitude and inability of our audience to be able to take the time to distinguish different species of dinosaur, why are we assuming they have paid attention to any relevant fiction? Certainly this is counter to the base argument that Hasbro is marketing to and assuming the "lowest common demoninator." What happens when little Jake the introverted 7-year-old who talks to himself asks his parent for the car TF? Or that red guy? There is a reason why lowest common denominator has a negative connotation in business, you can't run effectively that way. Priorities outta whack.
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#492 Shockwave 75

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 04:45 PM

While I'd rather unified colour scheme Dinobots, I'd take a neo-G2 appraoch. I'd probably bitch about it, but I'd still buy them if they were the only options open to me; much like I'll probably end up doing with the Combatacons.

#493 ▲ndrusi

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 05:11 PM

QUOTE(GALVATRON I @ May 10 2012, 05:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Seems kind of silly to assume that this dinosaur recognition issue is so complex considering two decades ago Dinobots kept shipping for years due to popularity despite all featuring similar colors (and selling at a higher pricepoint). Then again in Euro Classics and G2.

While your "well obviously the market works in whatever way is most convenient for producing exactly the toys Hasbro isn't producing that I wish they would produce" rants have a tendency to make me feel embarrassed on your behalf, the main reason I'm cutting you off here is to point out that you appear to have drastically misremembered the G2 Dinobots.

QUOTE(orionpax44 @ Jun 24 2012, 01:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Childrens toys? whaa the boxes seriously say ages 5+ I consider myself the plus.
QUOTE(mx-01 archon @ Sep 9 2012, 01:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You're talking to ▲ndrusi. Assume everything that he posts is snark.

#494 Dante

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 05:26 PM

No, he didn't. At all. In fact I seem to recall never being able to find the properly colored ones because they actually sold. Sold out, in fact. Technicolor Dinobots? Peg-warmers.


#495 Smitty

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 05:29 PM

I thought we had already covers the color thing already, remember Armada and the Hotshot and Demolisher repaints both being red and having to be in different waves? I know we have come to the point now where Hasbro is confident in people to tell a tank form a car but no one can tell a car from a car.

I'm not a fan of voting on peoples posts. it just seems very passive aggressive to click 'down vote' and not add anything to the thread. and up votes are exactly the same. to my mind the whole point of a forum is discussion and being able to just easily agree or disagree takes the discussion out of the equation.


#496 CORVUS

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 05:35 PM

QUOTE(TrentTroop @ May 8 2012, 10:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The Insecticons need a similar upgrade, and they probably need to trade in one of their beetles for a Preying Mantis or something akin.

I would be SO down with that.

Transformers is a brand that really has something for everyone. We are a darn lucky fandom.


#497 Fishbug

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 05:48 PM

QUOTE(Dr Corvus @ May 10 2012, 06:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(TrentTroop @ May 8 2012, 10:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The Insecticons need a similar upgrade, and they probably need to trade in one of their beetles for a Preying Mantis or something akin.

I would be SO down with that.

THE RETURN OF MANTERROR.

#498 Rosicrucian

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 06:02 PM

I would be in favor of lots of different Insecticons. I know the big three have sentimental value, but c'mon. Most continuities have thousands of Insecticons in them. I want a big ol' rhino beetle Insecticon from Prime. I'd love a preying mantis one. I could even dig a firefly-based one. Give 'em all new names.

#499 CORVUS

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 06:26 PM

So long as the Firefly one had a light-up butt, that'd be fine by me icon-fire.gif

Transformers is a brand that really has something for everyone. We are a darn lucky fandom.


#500 Esser-Z

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 06:26 PM

Yesss more bugbots. Organic or robotic alt mode, either way I crave!



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