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Meotic Vehicle Modes


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#1 SteamPunk Astrotrain

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 11:40 AM

I'm working on a fan-made tech project involving a creature that was cyborged, or perhaps, more acurately roboticed, into a multi-component, transforming robot. While the figure I'm working with is from Power Rangers, in trying to figure it out has raised a couple of interesting questions, that do have a bearing on the Transformers universe. And I'm smart enough to know that exploring it from a Transformers angle, might give me insight that works perfectly well, for Power Rangers too.

The main question I need to ask you folks has to do with the concept of a Miotic Spark and an ability to assume multiple vehicle modes, like Omega Supreme and the Duocons. Magmatron is in a different catagory, in this instance, because he splits into a trio of organic beasts. Still he is worth mentioning. My question is this: How would a Cybertronian, with the gene for splitting himself into multiple, separate components in alt-mode; be able to scan in and replicate them?

Put simply, when he was created, did G1 Omega Supreme scan in a tank, the track, and the entire rocket base, simultaneously? Is his t-cog as miotic as his spark? Were the Duocons bodies literally sawed in half and each given a T-Cog? Or is it the other way around? While there have been modern examples of objects being endowed with Allspark energy, and becoming transformers, none of them are definitive enough to say with any certainty that a modern Cybertronian can be created, from a combination of pre-gathered alt-modes infused with Allspark Energy. Of course, the fact that Omega Supreme has a single, spacecraft alt-mode in War For Cybertron, only complicates matters.

I would love to hear how you folks think an alt-mode reverse-combiner could be created. Just please, keep the jokes to a minimum, because I'm attempting to ask a question in all seriousness, here.

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#2 Boltax

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 11:47 AM

As far as I'm aware the only specific origin for Omega Supreme that shows WHERE he got his alt mode (in the cartoon it seems to be more-or-less assumed that his alt mode has always been the same), is in the US comics. In that version he was built by Grapple. So he was just BUILT with that alt mode.

Most of the fiction seems to suggest that charcters like the Duocons were just BUILT that way. (For example Dreamwave MTMTE.)

--Andrew S.
(And that's the TINY amount of fiction that actually addresses it at all.)

Edited by Boltax, 24 March 2012 - 11:52 AM.


#3 WorkbenchManiac

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 11:56 AM

QUOTE(SteamPunk Astrotrain @ Mar 24 2012, 11:40 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Miotic Spark

Miosis it the contraction of the pupil.


I suppose you meant either meiosis or mitosis.

Mitosis is the division of one cell into two.

Meiosis is a variant of mitosis in eukaryotes, in which through two subsequent cell divisions the haploidic gametes are produced.

Even if only taken metaphorically, I don't know what you are asking. AFAIK sparks do not reproduce by division, nor do sparks have "genes" (a gene is a distinct unit of inheritance), because, again, AFAIK sparks do not reproduce.

Could you please clarify what you meant?

EDIT: Just to be clear, I don't want to harsh on your terminology, I'm just not clear on what is asked. "How did X scan two modes" is simple enough, but I don't get the connection to sparks or mitosis.

Edited by WorkbenchManiac, 24 March 2012 - 12:05 PM.


#4 Chris McFeely

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:09 PM

QUOTE(WorkbenchManiac @ Mar 24 2012, 04:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Even if only taken metaphorically, I don't know what you are asking. AFAIK sparks do not reproduce by division, nor do sparks have "genes" (a gene is a distinct unit of inheritance), because, again, AFAIK sparks do not reproduce.

Could you please clarify what you meant?

EDIT: Just to be clear, I don't want to harsh on your terminology, I'm just not clear on what is asked. "How did X scan two modes" is simple enough, but I don't get the connection to sparks or mitosis.


"Mitotic Spark" was the term used in Magmatron's BM bio to describe his ability to split himself into three parts. He's asking about Transformers who split from one robot form into multi-component alternate modes.

Edited by Chris McFeely, 24 March 2012 - 12:10 PM.


#5 Cybersnark

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:19 PM

QUOTE(Boltax @ Mar 24 2012, 12:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Most of the fiction seems to suggest that charcters like the Duocons were just BUILT that way.

Well, rebuilt. By Shockwave. In a process that eventually led to creating triple-changers.

Perhaps Shockwave's earlier experiments involved trying to implant two T-cogs into a single transformer (each programmed for a different transformation). Unfortunately, the resonance between the two T-cogs caused the victims subjects to get ripped apart divide into two separate components, each with its own T-cog (and perhaps with the spark in one and the neural-CPU in the other). Several specimens died screaming from the agony expired from trauma before the process could be refined.

Latter experiments managed to synchronize the T-cogs, allowing a single individual to reliably access two alt-modes. Though earlier builds did experience some (minor) neurological trauma from the process. icon-blitz.gif

Decepticon science. We do what we must, because we can. . .

#6 Destron D-69

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:31 PM

A God did it. Its kinda a Magic thing they do. Every transformer is a tiny speck of their God's soul.

and if I've learned anything form PNR... saying 'God said so' is a fairly applicable answer

icon-fire.gif

on a technology side: it works a few ways.

Omega Supreme is One robot who's 'lasercore' and 'personality chips' control all parts of him simultaneously

Optimus Prime, roller and the trailer function on a similar wireless network... but do not seem to have a linked personality like Omega Supreme.

sometimes for G1 and series linked to G1-isms its best to remember that Sparks were invented in Beastwars

Transformers have innate access to a sub-space dimension... perhaps this has some link to the spirit-bodies relationship ?

Overlord O-o that's got a bit of continuity him and hah depending where you're looking these days.

I can't remember how they addressed the Pretender shell thing back in G1 >_>


#7 WorkbenchManiac

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:35 PM

QUOTE(Chris McFeely @ Mar 24 2012, 12:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
"Mitotic Spark" was the term used in Magmatron's BM bio to describe his ability to split himself into three parts. He's asking about Transformers who split from one robot form into multi-component alternate modes.

Thanks for the clarification.

I shall go on a wiki-binge later...

#8 Lazy Garou

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 12:56 PM

QUOTE(Cybersnark @ Mar 24 2012, 12:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Boltax @ Mar 24 2012, 12:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Most of the fiction seems to suggest that charcters like the Duocons were just BUILT that way.

Well, rebuilt. By Shockwave. In a process that eventually led to creating triple-changers.

Perhaps Shockwave's earlier experiments involved trying to implant two T-cogs into a single transformer (each programmed for a different transformation). Unfortunately, the resonance between the two T-cogs caused the victims subjects to get ripped apart divide into two separate components, each with its own T-cog (and perhaps with the spark in one and the neural-CPU in the other). Several specimens died screaming from the agony expired from trauma before the process could be refined.

Latter experiments managed to synchronize the T-cogs, allowing a single individual to reliably access two alt-modes. Though earlier builds did experience some (minor) neurological trauma from the process. icon-blitz.gif

Decepticon science. We do what we must, because we can. . .


shockwave probaly smiles a little inside every time he gets away defying Primus laws.
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#9 Creature SH

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 01:18 PM

Few things are as unsettling as the idea of Shockwave smiling.

#10 Autobus Prime

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 01:26 PM

QUOTE(Creature SH @ Mar 24 2012, 02:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Few things are as unsettling as the idea of Shockwave smiling.


shockwavelol.jpg





#11 Lazy Garou

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 01:35 PM

QUOTE(Creature SH @ Mar 24 2012, 01:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Few things are as unsettling as the idea of Shockwave smiling.


or him letting out a giggle while he holds your spark chamber in his hand , and thinking what's he going to do with it, and the rest of the parts he has at his lab.
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#12 corgsopal

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 03:05 PM

QUOTE(Pony of Merak @ Mar 24 2012, 11:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Cybersnark @ Mar 24 2012, 12:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Boltax @ Mar 24 2012, 12:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Most of the fiction seems to suggest that charcters like the Duocons were just BUILT that way.

Well, rebuilt. By Shockwave. In a process that eventually led to creating triple-changers.

Perhaps Shockwave's earlier experiments involved trying to implant two T-cogs into a single transformer (each programmed for a different transformation). Unfortunately, the resonance between the two T-cogs caused the victims subjects to get ripped apart divide into two separate components, each with its own T-cog (and perhaps with the spark in one and the neural-CPU in the other). Several specimens died screaming from the agony expired from trauma before the process could be refined.

Latter experiments managed to synchronize the T-cogs, allowing a single individual to reliably access two alt-modes. Though earlier builds did experience some (minor) neurological trauma from the process. icon-blitz.gif

Decepticon science. We do what we must, because we can. . .


shockwave probaly smiles a little inside every time he gets away defying Primus laws.

He could also be smiling on the outside, but only Whirl knows for sure.
Reclaim the suffix.

#13 SteamPunk Astrotrain

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 08:45 PM

Sorry about the confusion, WorkbenchManiac, I'm half-sick at the moment, so my writing skills aren't the best.
Like I said, I'm working on a bio for a character that was turned into a giant robot, who was then split into several vehicles. I was hoping that examining the few Transformers characters, with a similar ability, would give me some inspiration.
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DH "Are you kidding? Waspinator couldn't play a kazoo without fragging himself!"

#14 Autobus Prime

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Posted 24 March 2012 - 09:47 PM

QUOTE(SteamPunk Astrotrain @ Mar 24 2012, 09:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Sorry about the confusion, WorkbenchManiac, I'm half-sick at the moment, so my writing skills aren't the best.
Like I said, I'm working on a bio for a character that was turned into a giant robot, who was then split into several vehicles. I was hoping that examining the few Transformers characters, with a similar ability, would give me some inspiration.


Don't neglect other sources. You might even cast your net to days of long ago, to uncharted regions of the universe, and see what sort of legends grew there. Peace may have settled across the galaxy since then, maintained by a galactic alliance of the good planets of each solar system*, but there is always the chance that a new horrible menace may threaten, and the legendary character may be needed once more. I suggest talking to any super force of space explorers you may meet; they have been specially trained to bring back such robots.

Who knows? There may be robots out there split up into a whole rugby team of components, too...

*As opposed to the planets that suck. I always thought. Like the ones made of methane ice at a few kelvins. Not much of a summer crowd at a place like that. Unless you're cool with that sort of thing.

Edited by Autobus Prime, 24 March 2012 - 10:12 PM.





#15 ▲ndrusi

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:15 AM

QUOTE(Autobus Prime @ Mar 24 2012, 02:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Creature SH @ Mar 24 2012, 02:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Few things are as unsettling as the idea of Shockwave smiling.


shockwavelol.jpg

Okay, it isn't unsettling anymore. Now it's hilarious.

QUOTE(orionpax44 @ Jun 24 2012, 01:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Childrens toys? whaa the boxes seriously say ages 5+ I consider myself the plus.
QUOTE(mx-01 archon @ Sep 9 2012, 01:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You're talking to ▲ndrusi. Assume everything that he posts is snark.

#16 SteamPunk Astrotrain

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:42 AM

QUOTE(Autobus Prime @ Mar 24 2012, 10:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(SteamPunk Astrotrain @ Mar 24 2012, 09:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Sorry about the confusion, WorkbenchManiac, I'm half-sick at the moment, so my writing skills aren't the best.
Like I said, I'm working on a bio for a character that was turned into a giant robot, who was then split into several vehicles. I was hoping that examining the few Transformers characters, with a similar ability, would give me some inspiration.


Don't neglect other sources. You might even cast your net to days of long ago, to uncharted regions of the universe, and see what sort of legends grew there. Peace may have settled across the galaxy since then, maintained by a galactic alliance of the good planets of each solar system*, but there is always the chance that a new horrible menace may threaten, and the legendary character may be needed once more. I suggest talking to any super force of space explorers you may meet; they have been specially trained to bring back such robots.

Who knows? There may be robots out there split up into a whole rugby team of components, too...

*As opposed to the planets that suck. I always thought. Like the ones made of methane ice at a few kelvins. Not much of a summer crowd at a place like that. Unless you're cool with that sort of thing.


Unfortunately, I don't know of any other robots that would fit. Japan's famous for combiners but the reverse happens very seldom. And Voltron doesn't count, because he was separated into the five lions by magic, and doesn't have any sentience in his own right. Sentai's Daizyujin (MMPR Power Megazord) is closer, because it is sentient in it's robot form, but I don't think any explanation was ever given for why it was separated into the individual dinozords


And yes, Shockwave smiling is hilarious.
CW "We could always force him to watch that security footage of Waspinator trying to play an accordion.
DH "Are you kidding? Waspinator couldn't play a kazoo without fragging himself!"

#17 Otaku

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 01:15 PM

Are you dwelling more on the science, the pseudo-science, or the metaphysics of it?

The original topic, not Shockwave smiling. XD

If it is a human who slowly replaced himself with (to us) advanced technology, and later was split into transforming mecha, you could have the mind totally be dormant while they are separated, or perhaps parts of the mind inhabit each piece.

If it is the metaphysics of it... where does the soul reside in a normal human? Follow those guidelines, but assume that the soul was successfully transferred to the equivalent component's of the robotic form. Separating a component that doesn't contain these "bits" does nothing to the soul... or alternatively stretches or splits it. I mean, again, we are talking metaphysics here.

For other references, consider stories where a character can split pieces of his/her/its body off. Not just combiner style characters, but even guys like Buggy The Clown from One Piece. If you want some interesting ideas, try picking up GURPS. It is a role-playing system, and I know the GURPS: Powers supplement covers characters who can separate pieces of their body from the whole, and those pieces are capable of actions on their own (or at the behest of the character).
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#18 TheMightyMollusk

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 07:13 AM

QUOTE(WorkbenchManiac @ Mar 24 2012, 12:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Even if only taken metaphorically, I don't know what you are asking. AFAIK sparks do not reproduce by division, nor do sparks have "genes" (a gene is a distinct unit of inheritance), because, again, AFAIK sparks do not reproduce.

In the G2 comics, Transformers in the ancient past reproduced by division, but this was before sparks entered the picture. (And going too far caused Bad Things, like Jhiaxus's Cybertronians and the Swarm.)



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