Jump to content

Photo
- - - - -

You remember the dragon mom?


24 replies to this topic

#1 Automan2000

Automan2000

    Liberati tutumet ex infernis

  • Supporter
  • 4182 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Virginia Beach,VA
  • Faction::Cannonball's Pirate Crew

Posted 05 March 2011 - 11:35 AM

SOURCE
QUOTE
Rahna Reiko Rizzuto says that she never wanted to be a mother.

"I had this idea that motherhood was this really all-encompassing thing," she explained on the Today Show, where she was talking about her new memoir, "Hiroshima in the Morning." "I was afraid of being swallowed up by that."

Ten years ago, when her sons were 5 and 3, Rizzuto received a fellowship to spend six months in Japan, researching a book about the survivors of Hiroshima. Four months in, when her children came to visit, she had an epiphany: She didn't want to be a full-time mother anymore. When she returned to New York, she ended her 20-year marriage and chose not to be her kids' custodial parent.

Now, Rizzuto is an author and a faculty member at Goddard College in Vermont, where she teaches in creative writing. Her boys are teenagers?and, she says, they're fine. In fact, their relationship not only survived her leaving, but "has improved."

"I had to leave my children to find them," she writes in an essay at Salon.com. "In my part-time motherhood, I get concentrated blocks of time when I can be that 1950s mother we idealize who was waiting in an apron with fresh cookies when we got off the school bus and wasn't too busy for anything we needed until we went to bed. I go to every parent-teacher conference; I am there for performances and baseball games."



But when that 1950s mother she describes as ideal had to cope with parenthood 24/7, she didn't get to pick and choose which parts to be present for. The idea that a mother could love her children and still choose to leave them to pursue her own goals is the antithesis of being a 'Tiger Mother'?Amy Chua ignited a fiery debate with the release of her book about being a perfection-demanding Eastern-style parent, omnipresent in her daughters' lives. It also goes against our culture's definition of motherhood. But it shines a light on a glaring double standard: When a man chooses not to be a full-time parent, it's acceptable?or, at least, accepted. But when a woman decides to do so, it's abandonment.

The decision isn't an easy one to make, no matter how you feel about parenting. "‪It took me about a year to decide once the idea came to me," says Talyaa Liera. In 2008, she chose to move 3,000 miles away from three of her four children (her oldest is an adult and out on her own).‪ "At the time I was a heavily involved, attachment-parenting Waldorf mom. I did the whole family bed, breastfeeding-into-toddlerhood, baby-wearing thing. I was at home with them for 10 years before their father and I split up, and stayed at home after that, trying to create a writing career to support myself."‬

‪After a lengthy custody battle and two years of joint custody, she realized that her ex-husband (a pilot with an erratic schedule) wasn't going to change, and her situation wasn't going to change, unless she decided to change things for herself. "I realized that by being so nurturing, I was in some ways keeping my children from growing to their potential," she says. "We talked about it for months and we prepared together, not really knowing what being 3,000 miles apart might look like or feel like.‬"

When the time came to get in her packed car and drive away, she says, she felt "‪very mixed." ‬

‪"Yes, there is a sense of relief. I would be remiss if I did not admit that," she says candidly. But there was also pain: "‬I used to avoid Target, for instance, because it made me think of shopping for my daughter Serena. Little moments like that, and everything comes flooding in."

Now a spiritual adviser who writes at Polaris Rising, Liera wrote about her experiences as a non-custodial parent at Literary Mama and Parenting Without a Manual. Her children are 15, 11, and 7 now and, after more than two years of long-distance parenting, Liera says she misses them but feels very connected to them. "‪Now we stay in touch by phone, IM, Skype a few times a week," she says. "I hear about their lives and give support.‬"

‪"I have been a mother since I was 20," she points out. "I did not have the life a normal 20 year old would have. While I don't regret that, I knew that I now have the opportunity to reconnect with who I might have been then, but with all the tools and skill sets I have learned through motherhood. I have the unique opportunity most women don't get to have, of being able to truly create the life I wish to have, do something in the world that makes a difference, and model this kind of independence for my children."‬

After Amy Chua's story went viral, many women said they felt they needed to adopt a bit of the tiger mom mentality, that maybe they were a little to lenient with their kids. In any case, it's evident that there's no one-size-fits-all when it comes to motherhood. But does striking out on your own or being a "Hiroshima Mom" take free-range parenting to an extreme?

"This is the question people will ask me. The question that curls, now, in the dark of the night," Rizzuto writes in "Hiroshima in the Morning." "How do any of us decide to leave the people we love?"


So, I ask you which is worse? An overbearing and overly strict mother or one that just decides that she doesn't want to be a mother anymore?

I cannot express adequately how angry this woman makes me. Being that I became estranged from my father when he decided that his new wife was far more important than his own kids. Knowing first hand the emotional damage that it causes I can only think of this woman as the lowest form of slime on the planet.


#2 AnkhChalice

AnkhChalice
  • Citizen
  • 1565 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Dover NH
  • Faction::Free Agent

Posted 05 March 2011 - 11:45 AM

This article makes me angry, a large part of that is because I'm very close to my mom. I can't think of many things that would be more devastating to know that your own mother doesn't want you. It really bothers me.

#3 RockinRobin

RockinRobin

    Survived the pony outbreak of '83, only to be REINFECTED!

  • Supporter
  • 424 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:West Michigan. Home of the Dutch Mafia.
  • Faction::Lesbian Ninja

Posted 05 March 2011 - 11:57 AM

Agreed. icon-megs.gif

I comfort myself in the knowledge that when the day comes that she 'needs' her children to be there for her, and sacrifice on her behalf?that they will follow in her footsteps: stick her selfish ass in a nursing home and forget she exists for many years. Life lesson, well taught.



The greatest 'achievement' my mother ever did was to be a great mom.
Consequently, I never regretted a single minute of caring for her at home while she was dying?considering it a privilege.


#4 Rhinox

Rhinox

    Yeah, I'm kind of pissy.

  • Supporter
  • 12634 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Topeka, Kansas
  • Faction::Maximal

Posted 05 March 2011 - 12:09 PM

I'm sorry, but there is no such thing as a 'part time parent'. You are either a parent or you aren't. It's a very black and white kind of thing.

"Why does history repeat itself? Because God doesn't have TiVo."

Wounds of honor are always self inflicted.


#5 Darkstream

Darkstream

    The original darkstream since 2003!

  • Supporter
  • 20494 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Aka K.I.R.A.
  • Faction::Minicon

Posted 05 March 2011 - 12:34 PM

QUOTE(Rhinox @ Mar 5 2011, 12:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm sorry, but there is no such thing as a 'part time parent'. You are either a parent or you aren't. It's a very black and white kind of thing.

oh how i wish this was true, its not so black and white. Not when ones parents are parents of convenience like mine.

#6 Rhinox

Rhinox

    Yeah, I'm kind of pissy.

  • Supporter
  • 12634 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Topeka, Kansas
  • Faction::Maximal

Posted 05 March 2011 - 12:52 PM

Being a parent is not something you turn off or clock out of at the end of the day. I work for 8 to 10 hours a day without being around my son. I don't magically stop being a dad during that time. I still think of him and my wife in those hours, how I can improve myself as a father, et al. When I come home, I'm still the same guy that left.

"Why does history repeat itself? Because God doesn't have TiVo."

Wounds of honor are always self inflicted.


#7 Slander

Slander

    The boys are back!

  • MORON
  • 0 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Baton Rouge, LA
  • Faction::Maximal

Posted 05 March 2011 - 01:00 PM

Man. What a selfish, irresponsible bitch. Justify it to yourself any way you want, lady, you're a horrible person and I hope I never meet a woman like you.

And no, it's not a double standard. Men are just as reviled for abandoning their kids like that - moreso, in fact, because it's become a stereotype.

#8 Galenraff

Galenraff

    Oh, by the way I've cracked the code.

  • Special Projects Manager
  • 31401 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Central Illinois
  • Faction::Maximal

Posted 05 March 2011 - 01:49 PM

How nice for her that she's rationalized being a deadbeat mother who abandoned her family. Even nicer for her that she's found a sympathetic voice and audience for the story.

Nice for her - but crappy for everyone else. The husband she left, the kids she walked away for, the responsibilities she shirked, and the bad example she set. Just because the kids turn out okay doesn't justify being an absent, irresponsible deadbeat.

It's not a noble "journey of personal discovery" or anything when a father does it, and it isn't here either.

LookUp_zps6fe77c23.jpg


#9 Darkstream

Darkstream

    The original darkstream since 2003!

  • Supporter
  • 20494 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Aka K.I.R.A.
  • Faction::Minicon

Posted 05 March 2011 - 02:02 PM

QUOTE(Rhinox @ Mar 5 2011, 12:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Being a parent is not something you turn off or clock out of at the end of the day. I work for 8 to 10 hours a day without being around my son. I don't magically stop being a dad during that time. I still think of him and my wife in those hours, how I can improve myself as a father, et al. When I come home, I'm still the same guy that left.


Let me explain, I dont disagree with you, I would think we both have the same outlook on what it is to be a parent. Its a 24hr job in our point of view. Am i correct?

That being said my parents are not like this.
My dad being the bigger example was more of a friend. Who after around 8 was barely there, then moved to cali and basically left us with our mother, who thought it was better to make the guy she was with more important than her own kids. Not to say she wasnt there for us, But most of the time it was and is only so she can play victim to the situation and gather sympathy From people.

part time parents happen all the time, That doesnt make that right.

#10 BB Shockwave

BB Shockwave

    Arachnofiliac

  • Citizen
  • 10765 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Hungary
  • Faction::Decepticon

Posted 05 March 2011 - 02:32 PM

QUOTE(Automan2000 @ Mar 5 2011, 05:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
SOURCE
QUOTE
Rahna Reiko Rizzuto says that she never wanted to be a mother.

So, I ask you which is worse? An overbearing and overly strict mother or one that just decides that she doesn't want to be a mother anymore?

I cannot express adequately how angry this woman makes me. Being that I became estranged from my father when he decided that his new wife was far more important than his own kids. Knowing first hand the emotional damage that it causes I can only think of this woman as the lowest form of slime on the planet.


I have to say to that quote from Rizzuto - "Then DON'T ****ing bear children!" If you did, then raise them as a good mother. icon-megs.gif Otherwise, feel free to be a lesbian or a carrier-only woman, whichever suits you. It's not like women are expected to pump out kids anymore in any civilised state.

My father left our family when I was 15, and trust me, it was very hard to lose a parent (we pretty much only met for a few hours on Sundays and he wanted to spend more time with his new family). I have a very strong bond with my mom, even had it before my dad left. So, I cannot even imagine her leaving us (and she would have never done so). But I know of such an woman like this one... she left her two children behind after his husband cheated on him, and is now living in a relationship, not really giving a damn about her kids. That is, until the husband sued her for the flat, when she pretty much coerced her own son to turn on his father and sign the deed to her... as a result, the father sent the kid away from home, and she is now living with a mother who for 10 years didn't even care about her. Must be real nice. icon-screamer.gif

People who leave their kids and families and don't care about them are scum. I know people who divorced their wives/husbands, but still spent most of their times with their children, as far as law would allow. Breaking up with the mother/father of your kids should not mean you automatically break all bonds to your own kids...

Edited by BB Shockwave, 05 March 2011 - 02:34 PM.

Boo-Sig.jpg


#11 Waspinator

Waspinator

    Is that your final Dandy?

  • Citizen
  • 20298 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The State of Misery
  • Faction::Equestrian

Posted 05 March 2011 - 04:09 PM

If she never wanted to be a mother, why the hell did she have four kids?

#12 Defunct

Defunct

    Not to be funct with. . .

  • Retired Staff
  • 26834 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA
  • Faction::RIBFIR

Posted 05 March 2011 - 06:16 PM

So, so pleased that everyone agrees this woman is a failure. What kind of selfish jackass decides they don't feel like being a mother any more?
. . .

#13 Detour

Detour

    People.... What a bunch of bastards!

  • Supporter
  • 17813 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:123 Carenden Road
  • Faction::Cannonball's Pirate Crew

Posted 05 March 2011 - 07:16 PM

QUOTE(Waspinator @ Mar 5 2011, 04:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
If she never wanted to be a mother, why the hell did she have four kids?

I think you're getting the women mixed up, there are two women discussing this in the article. The one quoted as never having wanted to be a mother only had two.

You're far too young to be this bitter and angry at the world....

I'm reading that with Roy's voice. Heck, I read everything you post in a laconic Irish accent.

 


#14 Hecate

Hecate

    Beyond the Bounds

  • Citizen
  • 28251 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Up a tree

Posted 05 March 2011 - 07:53 PM

My mother looked after me through childhood, but once I reached my teenage years she basically left the country to pursue better jobs. She paid for schooling and stuff, I just lived with my grandparents instead. It's not that she dislikes me or anything, she just prefers working and climbing the corporate ladder.

superliminalsubliminalliminal


#15 Automan2000

Automan2000

    Liberati tutumet ex infernis

  • Supporter
  • 4182 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Virginia Beach,VA
  • Faction::Cannonball's Pirate Crew

Posted 05 March 2011 - 11:42 PM

QUOTE(Never Give Up! @ Mar 5 2011, 07:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
My mother looked after me through childhood, but once I reached my teenage years she basically left the country to pursue better jobs. She paid for schooling and stuff, I just lived with my grandparents instead. It's not that she dislikes me or anything, she just prefers working and climbing the corporate ladder.

The problem with that is that motherhood is not something you leave behind because it becomes inconvenient or you would rather do other things.

If you are not willing to take on a lifelong commitment then don't have kids.

#16 Waspinator

Waspinator

    Is that your final Dandy?

  • Citizen
  • 20298 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The State of Misery
  • Faction::Equestrian

Posted 06 March 2011 - 12:10 AM

QUOTE(Detour @ Mar 5 2011, 06:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Waspinator @ Mar 5 2011, 04:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
If she never wanted to be a mother, why the hell did she have four kids?

I think you're getting the women mixed up, there are two women discussing this in the article. The one quoted as never having wanted to be a mother only had two.

Ok, my bad. Still, why even two? If you don't want the commitment, don't have the kids. And that applies to fathers, too. Having a kid is a serious commitment that I think people often take too lightly. Deciding to have kids should be thought about very carefully before you actually do it since even if you later decide you don't want kids, guess what: the kid is still there. Someone's going to have to take care of him or her, even if it's not you. And dumping responsibility on someone else is just plain selfish.

#17 Kalidor

Kalidor

    Get some!

  • Owner
  • 55512 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Faction::Cannonball's Pirate Crew

Posted 06 March 2011 - 01:46 AM

I haven't talked to my dead beat mother in about 12 years. I spent the day with my dad, however, browsing around computer stores, having lunch and dinner and going grocery shopping just to hang out.

I turned out okay. But I don't like my mother. And I don't like this ignorant bitch either.

#18 Destron D-69

Destron D-69

    hug Destron

  • Citizen
  • 22518 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Canada
  • Faction::Lesbian Ninja

Posted 06 March 2011 - 01:18 PM

you can pick your friends, but you can't pick your family ... though its perfectly within reason to disassociate yourself from them.

I would certainly do so were I related to this woman.

Edited by Destron D-69, 06 March 2011 - 01:19 PM.

18+ returns in 2 weeks.

#19 Master Fwiffo

Master Fwiffo

    Yay...

  • Retired Staff
  • 17543 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Lost Light
  • Faction::RIBFIR

Posted 06 March 2011 - 01:28 PM

That article is terrible. These attitudes are exactly what's wrong with people these days.

#20 Skullgrin2014

Skullgrin2014
  • Citizen
  • 2448 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Faction::Decepticon

Posted 06 March 2011 - 04:53 PM

See, this is all that bothers me. I wasn't trying to be misogynistic in the other thread.

I just had meant that before something like this used to be "unthinkable".


What bothers me about modern culture is that people use freedom and equal rights as an excuse to not take their part in social responsibility.


That said I don't hate this woman, I think she just went about finding some freedom to do things she likes the wrong way.

If her husbands schedule was "erratic" why couldn't her and hubby work on a plan to have a maid or sitter. To give her some time to pursue her own goals.

The thing that gets to me is people who don't understand what compromise is.


Im sure she could have explored her dreams and still raise her kids if she used her head.

But to be fair she ultimately has a right to choice. I also can sympathize with a person not living the life they want to. But, it's the fact that she wen't about it wrong that I think is sad,


It just sort of bothers me how divorces now seem to be over the most stupidest things. It's not like back in the day when hubby is a control freak, or an abuser. People now leave perfectly good husbands and wives over the most stupidest things.

I mean I do agree that people shouldn't have to be people pleasers and I can on some level emphasize with her side of the story. That she might have realized she wanted something different out of life.


But people make these spur of the moment decisions in such stupid ways.


Then again she did marry too young, people in their early 20's tend to not know what they want in life yet. It sounds like one of those cases where she married too young.

It's hard for me to really see it from only one viewpoint. I don't think what she did was fair to her kids or husband. But in another light she does have a right to decide the life she wants to live.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Smolder-and-his-pal-Chopster/1497598050488573



Reply to this topic



  


0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users