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@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 02:39 PM)

the debate sems to be over.

@  MEDdMI : (24 August 2016 - 02:37 PM)

Wouldn't it be easier to debate this in the comics subforum?

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 01:31 PM)

I don't have anything else to say (although I still think G2 is the true ending, even if G I Joe doesn't mention it, it seems G I Joe/G2 crossover isn't canon for G I Joe comics but only for the Transformers continuity)

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 01:29 PM)

ok whatever you won.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 01:27 PM)

that's why I said "if", I dunno I didn't read G2 or G I Joe. 

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 01:26 PM)

Also,you're still basing this entirely on G2 matching a storyline that was part of G2 itself rather than whether or not G2 matches better with the G1 comic proper.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 01:24 PM)

The idea kind of falls apart when it requires that the apocalyptic alien invasions had such little impact that everyone easily just ignored forever.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 01:17 PM)

If some issues of G I Joe comics is a prelude to G2 and if there's nothing in the future G I Joe stories that condradicts San Francisco getting destroyed, yes I would say they share a continuity. 

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 01:02 PM)

If you're gonna go "we can assume it did happen even though it's never talked about as long as nothing specifically contradicts it", then surely it's just as easy to assume that the actual G1 TF and Joe crossover happened in the backstory of Classics and RG1.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 01:02 PM)

also I refrained from mentioning Ask Vector Prime but but didn't it say RG1 is a splinter timeline?

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 12:58 PM)

has san francisco ever appeared in G I Joe stories that was chronologically set after G2?

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:55 PM)

Intent is not the same as result. And comics end up ignoring things quite often.

@  Telly : (24 August 2016 - 12:54 PM)

maybe they figured a lot of people that read gi joe also read transformers. so they throw a crossover/build up in their to get some excitement for the new comic coming

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 12:51 PM)

If G2 universe was to be unrelated to G I Joe, why did they do a prelude to it?

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:33 PM)

Classics and RG1 not including Joe issues 138-145 in their backstory does not preclude them from including TF 1-80, or even the Joe and TF miniseries.

@  TheMightyMol... : (24 August 2016 - 12:30 PM)

Marvel 616 is also a massive continuity snarl from dozens of writers altering, retconning, or ignoring each others' work for decades, so it's not really a great example for an argument on continuity.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 12:29 PM)

Marvel 616 continuity is a shared universe, devastating events happens in individual series but does mean every event gets mentioned in other comics? @Notvery knightly, yeah that's why I edited that post.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:27 PM)

Your proof for "TF universe = Joe universe" itself is the G2 lead-up, so your reasoning still goes back to G2 matching G2.

@  TheMightyMol... : (24 August 2016 - 12:25 PM)

So did GI Joe ever reference the time Bludgeon sent his entire force to rampage across the Earth? Or the time Jhiaxus blew San Francisco into a crater?

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 12:25 PM)

whatever.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:22 PM)

Are you not seeing the recursiveness of "G2 is the true G1 sequel because G2 follows up on a G2 storyline"?

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 12:18 PM)

Yeah it has been established that Marvel Transformers and G I Joe comics takes place in the same universe. Unless 90s G I Joe was a reboot I'm pretty sure the G2 crossing over to a G I Joe comic that takes place in the very same universe as the original Transformers makes G2 the canon ending.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:16 PM)

A crossover that the Joe comic apparently ignored.

@  Arazyr : (24 August 2016 - 12:15 PM)

They had a crossover before that, 1986. http://tfwiki.net/wi...he_Transformers

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:15 PM)

Did G.I. Joe acknowledge the planet getting wrecked by the Swarm? Because otherwise it's more like "Marvel Transformers is the same universe as Marvel G.I. Joe only when they feel like it".

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:11 PM)

You're using the G.I. Joe G2 prequel itself as the basis for "Marvel Transformers universe is the same universe as the Marvel G I Joe", which makes this a rather loopy argument.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 12:07 PM)

As I said before, Marvel Transformers universe is the same universe as the Marvel G I Joe. Marvel G I Joe crossovers with G2, which makes G2 the canon ending. 

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 11:59 AM)

How is that relevant to whether or not RG1 (or Classics, even) takes place after issues 1 through 80 of Marvel TF proper?

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 11:51 AM)

it's a prequel to G2, which makes it the same universe as G2.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 11:48 AM)

That's clearly not in G2 itself, seeing as it's G.I. Joe issue 138.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 11:45 AM)

@NotVrtyKnightly Im talking about these issues. http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Unfoldings!

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (24 August 2016 - 11:30 AM)

Now for my part, I consider Marvel G2/Alignment the "true" ending because of Simon Furman's involvement in it, its continuous narrative with Marvel G1, and its sequential publication.

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (24 August 2016 - 11:28 AM)

The nature of multiple spinoffs/branching timelines means that to call any one spinoff the "true" ending is an arbitrary decision.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 11:16 AM)

Joe doesn't take place "in G2". Even their Marvel TF-related history isn't confined entirely to a single publication from the 90s.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 11:08 AM)

Look, oirignal Marvel Transformers takes place in the same universe as G I Joe and G I Joe takes place in the same universe as G2, which makes G2 the true canon ending.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 11:07 AM)

And it's not like anyone would argue that Rebirth wasn't actually the fourth season of the Sunbow cartoon entirely based on the lack of Ramirez and Old Snake.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 11:07 AM)

No you don't get it, I'm not saying RG1 is "less true" because G I Joe doesn't show up.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 10:54 AM)

Also, it's set decades later and earth was wrecked. Surely you don't need an explanation of why the Joes don't show up.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 10:53 AM)

None of that makes RG1 less "true".

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 10:41 AM)

How is it odd? G I joe and Transformers are canonically in the same continuty. Marvel Transformers continuity is a shared universe. G I Joe is canon and they had a crossover with G2, which makes it canon too, simple as that.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 09:30 AM)

an odd thing to say, surely.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 09:30 AM)

If you haven't read them, picking one over the other because of the presence of G.I. Joes is just

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 09:24 AM)

Also even though it's not officially published, I believe Alignment is canon since it was referenced in Ask Vector Prime and Allspark Almanac.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 09:22 AM)

I don't have an opinion on neither G2 or RG1 since I didn't read them.

@  Dracula : (24 August 2016 - 07:54 AM)

G2 was kind of miserable but even that is preferable to RG1.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 07:14 AM)

I don't think RG1 is the true ending to the Marvel because G. I Joe was in the same continuity as Transformers and they had a crossover with G2, not RG1 (obviously RG1 didn't exist back then). So G2/Alignment is the true ending.

@  TheMightyMol... : (24 August 2016 - 02:20 AM)

Why do you hate yourself?

@  LBD "Nyt... : (24 August 2016 - 12:45 AM)

I still need to read everything after Vol. 1 of RG1...

@  Telly : (23 August 2016 - 11:47 PM)

i really wouldve liked to see rg1 pick up where the marvel run left off (or just a couple years after), instead of jumping 20 years. i wanna see how shit went down on earth

@  Dracula : (23 August 2016 - 09:54 PM)

After RG1, I'd just as soon have nobody ever touch the marvel continuity again


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SD Gundam Discussion Thread ... uh... Part 2!


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#1 Zapper Zaku

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Posted 12 February 2011 - 11:41 AM

I have no idea what's going on with the other thread but here is a new one.

First off, for some reason, episode 44 is missing from Goodanime.net. I haven't checked other sites to see if it's missing there too but it's still annoying to see it not there.

Episode 45 does have subs, though. icon-hotrod.gif

And here is episode 46. I con't believe the series is almost over. There definately has to be something after the 52 episodes.



*Gasp* A duel between Sun Quan and Liu Bei?! Kick his butt, Sun Quan!! Make your uncle Gouf proud!

And... the rock dies? What the heck?

Oh, well. Cao Cao is going to have to face The Power Of Friendship!! (or allies. Whatever) I guess I need to buy that Red Cliff of Yu and Liang now. They are my favorite in that movie. Well, I do like the movie version of Cao Cao but that'd be pushing it. Hehehe.

Next episode I guess the fighting officially begins. O_O And we actually get another girl on the show?! I'm amazed. Now if only I could get the Daio Chan kit without spending money on a Bluray I can't use. -_-;

You think we'll ever see the G Gundams in this show?

Edited by Zapper Zaku, 12 February 2011 - 12:56 PM.


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#2 HellCat

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 05:01 AM

I believe the G characters are unlockable in the DS game, so it's likely they'll appear at some point. Bandai seems to have hidden a ton of later characters in it and only really reveal the codes when they appear...which the G designs haven't...um....

If they do appear, I hope we get more kits. Last time we only got God Gundam, Nobel Gundam and an elephant. Versions of the 4 Kings/Kibao Horde appeared in the manga, having betrayed their country to serve evil. Kits of those would be nice. Was always kind of sad we never got toys or kits of the Kibao Horde..

#3 Zapper Zaku

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 09:40 PM

QUOTE(HellCat @ Feb 15 2011, 05:01 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I believe the G characters are unlockable in the DS game, so it's likely they'll appear at some point. Bandai seems to have hidden a ton of later characters in it and only really reveal the codes when they appear...which the G designs haven't...um....

If they do appear, I hope we get more kits. Last time we only got God Gundam, Nobel Gundam and an elephant. Versions of the 4 Kings/Kibao Horde appeared in the manga, having betrayed their country to serve evil. Kits of those would be nice. Was always kind of sad we never got toys or kits of the Kibao Horde..


You know, I always wondered where in the world they came up with the elephant. I was rewatching G Gundam and there is a elephant gundam (Is it called Mammoth Gundam? *shrug* Not sure) that appears for a split second during the tournaments. Of all the gundams they could have picked, they choose the one with barely any screentime.

Dragon Gundam and Shadow Gundam are my favorites from that show and I really wish they'd do something with them.

G Gundam gets no love. icon-screamer.gif

Yes! We need the Kibao Horde! And Commander Sazabi! And the Dogas! And Zakobusshis!

Edited by Zapper Zaku, 15 February 2011 - 09:41 PM.


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#4 HellCat

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Posted 16 February 2011 - 04:37 PM

QUOTE(Zapper Zaku @ Feb 15 2011, 09:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(HellCat @ Feb 15 2011, 05:01 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I believe the G characters are unlockable in the DS game, so it's likely they'll appear at some point. Bandai seems to have hidden a ton of later characters in it and only really reveal the codes when they appear...which the G designs haven't...um....

If they do appear, I hope we get more kits. Last time we only got God Gundam, Nobel Gundam and an elephant. Versions of the 4 Kings/Kibao Horde appeared in the manga, having betrayed their country to serve evil. Kits of those would be nice. Was always kind of sad we never got toys or kits of the Kibao Horde..


You know, I always wondered where in the world they came up with the elephant. I was rewatching G Gundam and there is a elephant gundam (Is it called Mammoth Gundam? *shrug* Not sure) that appears for a split second during the tournaments. Of all the gundams they could have picked, they choose the one with barely any screentime.

Dragon Gundam and Shadow Gundam are my favorites from that show and I really wish they'd do something with them.

G Gundam gets no love. icon-screamer.gif

Yes! We need the Kibao Horde! And Commander Sazabi! And the Dogas! And Zakobusshis!


Well, said elephant turns into both an exo-suit and a tank. So I think, as whoever wrote the TV Tropes page said, they decided to go with something that merged the old fashioned and modern day versions of a war weapon....which gets weirder given the current series has given us actual tank siege weapons based on an MS tank from 0083.
I think the sad truth is that G doesn't get any respect now adays. If you look at the SD series that came out following it ( http://en.wikipedia...._Daishougun_Hen ), both the SD versions of Shining and God Gundam were said to be highly intelligent in addition to strong fighters. Nowadays though, if G is represented in anything crossover wise the characters are implied to be hotblooded idiots who just shout everything, fall for obvious traps and want to punch everything. Look at how they handled Baku in SDGF.

At least we have the old series to enjoy. You can get a Musha Dragon and Spiegel from that fairly easily (Dragon was even remolded to become Ryuubi's adopted son...and funnily enough, Spiegel into Chouhi's BIOLOGICAL son).

Edited by HellCat, 16 February 2011 - 04:51 PM.


#5 Zapper Zaku

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Posted 19 February 2011 - 01:49 AM

Episode 47 I can't believe it's almost over! Waaahaaa! icon-screamer.gif



Okay there's a giant bird head on Cao Cao's palace. That's not egotistical at all.

Wait. Did they just do the... "steal arrows with boats" scheme? (I loved that part in Red Cliff) Must be the plan of the Master Fisherman.

Oooo! Bombs and bullets. icon-hotrod.gif

Zhang Fei and Lady Sun... *shakes head* But you know, I think they'd make a pretty cute couple. Heheheh.

Oh, yeah. Gouf will definately scare people with his flowery spiked shoulder of death. Gives me the creeps just looking at it. *shudder* I wonder what Cao Cao will say if they show up to battle with the flowers on.

No preview yet but next episode is the Red Cliff battle. However I did check the Muso gallery. Yep, Gouf's still has the flower. I forgot, his he supposed to die this time around?

Edited by Zapper Zaku, 19 February 2011 - 01:50 AM.


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#6 HellCat

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Posted 19 February 2011 - 06:09 AM

I'm assuming Gerbera ran off because her brother and Ryuubi are totally gay for each other? Not even his sworn brothers are into him that much.

In the manga, Gouf HIGHLIGHT to view:
kamikazes the special shell introduced here, after Hyaku Shiki is wounded by intense arrow fire.

#7 Zapper Zaku

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Posted 20 February 2011 - 01:44 PM

QUOTE(HellCat @ Feb 19 2011, 06:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm assuming Gerbera ran off because her brother and Ryuubi are totally gay for each other? Not even his sworn brothers are into him that much.

In the manga, Gouf HIGHLIGHT to view:
kamikazes the special shell introduced here, after Hyaku Shiki is wounded by intense arrow fire.


I wouldn't have said that Sun Quan was into Liu Bei 'cause up until now they weren't around each other.

Though I must say, that flower hand shake... didn't help things. icon-wildride.gif

Edited by Zapper Zaku, 20 February 2011 - 01:44 PM.


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#8 Zapper Zaku

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Posted 26 February 2011 - 09:31 AM

Episode 48!



I'll have to say that I was glad when the Sun clan pulled out the bombs to stop the annoying arrow attack (seriously, the raining arrows of death are getting old) but man! I had to laugh when it turned out that Cao Cao's boats were metal and started running them over.

Dang it, Gouf! Nooo! I knew it! I knew he was going to die! Blasted flowers cause nothing but destruction! I'm running out of favorites from the Sun clan due to death!

O________O *gasp* Evil bird ship of death!!

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#9 HellCat

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Posted 26 February 2011 - 10:26 AM



I want Acguy grunts, NOW!!

#10 Zapper Zaku

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Posted 26 February 2011 - 11:31 AM

*points* The Acguy dance was the best part!

Oh, and I forgot to mention, subs for 46 and 47 are out.

Also, I was looking up the episode list on Wikipedia. Bad news. It looks like it's only 51 episodes so there's only three more left instead of four. Next episode begins the big fight with Cao Cao; episode 50 -looks like Liu Bei's finally getting the celestrial armor; and I'm guessing episode 51 is going to wrap things up.

That really stinks. They'd better have something coming after this because there's still a lot of things missing. I mean, why even show the stuff about Ma Chao, the Doven Wolf, that turtle snake spirit thing, Britova's friend whose name escapes me, and of course our friend Sima Yi (come on, we know he's evil!!!!) if they are not going to explain it.

It's not fair, I tell you! And where on Earth are the action figures!? icon-screamer.gif

However, we might be getting it dubbed. According to someone on the koei warriors board, they have episode 2 dubbed. Check out the post near the bottom here: http://s13.zetaboard...opic/248977/28/

If and/or when I do find it, I'll definately let you know! At least that's some hopeful news.

Wait a second! Does this mean the Blu Rays might have dubs on them!?!

Edited by Zapper Zaku, 26 February 2011 - 12:04 PM.


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#11 Zapper Zaku

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Posted 05 March 2011 - 05:22 AM

Episode 49

http://www.youtube.c...nel_video_title

The pirates should have known better than trying to run into the path on Cao Cao's ship.

How in the world is the Sun Quan's boat still floating like that after being split in two? They should have sunk like the rest.

I really liked the battle between Cao Cao and Yu. I was going to say he was doing pretty good until his sword broke. It's funny that his one little arrow shot stopped Cao Cao's ship while everything else didn't. Dang it! Yet another Sun clan member bites the dust! I sure hope Yu landing in the water means he might be alive.

All three swords lighting up does not look like a good sign.

And, finally we get to see Liu Bei and Cao Cao fight.



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#12 HellCat

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Posted 05 March 2011 - 03:36 PM

A week ago, I was going to say I wasn't too worried about the series ending due to a few factors. For one, Wikipedia seems to be updating the episode count by standard Japanese TV seasons. But then one of my biggest reasons to be confident has just been shot down. I mentioned a while back that the new Ryuubi kit previews the two generals who have yet to appear. Given we know them from the first go around this didn't surprise me. But whilst building the kit tonight, I took special note of that section and that's when I saw it....both of them are listed with their BB number from the original line, putting out the suggestion Bandai is saying 'We aren't redoing them, but since we included the special armour for them...'. I really hope this isn't the case. If things are heading for an ending at this point, it'll be incredibly underwhelming.

#13 HellCat

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Posted 12 March 2011 - 05:38 PM

I'm assuming there was no episode this week, partly because of the terrible events and partly because a naval battle will lift no one's spirits right now icon-screamer.gif

#14 Zapper Zaku

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Posted 13 March 2011 - 04:44 AM

Yeah, I figured that there wouldn't be one, considering the circumstances. And this week too! I'm beginning to think Liu Bei's dragon armor just wasn't meant to be.

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#15 Zapper Zaku

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Posted 19 March 2011 - 04:13 AM

With the disaster and everything, I didn't think we'd get to see this for a while.

Episode 50! Yay!



Yay! Cao Cao and Liu Bei fight!

OMG! He's....He's alive! Yu's Alive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What the heck? Liu Bei's dragon sword broke... and he blew up.... AND the flower band broke?! icon-wildride.gif Awesome!

Dead people motivational underwater speech!

It's Fenn!!!! Finally! And Liu Bei doesn't even needs the seal 'cause he gets the theme song music!

No trailer yet but check out the Muso gallery! We soooo need more than one episode left! Look! There's Cao Pi AND the RED Sima Yi! I mean, come on! It wouldn't be right if we didn't get another season. Why tease us like this?

Edited by Zapper Zaku, 19 March 2011 - 05:07 AM.


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#16 HellCat

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Posted 19 March 2011 - 04:52 AM

He finally found his true resolve icon-hotrod.gif

The spirits were touching, but I'm sure that scene must have been a bit unsettling for some in Japan at the moment.

Poor Sousou. Like Shinn Asuka, the people he sends to a watery grave keep coming back.

I'm actually wondering now if a sequel is in the works. The preview looks to match the end of part 2 of the manga, with Sousou's son taking over and Sazabi in red. It's been about a year. Maybe a few weeks break and then back for spring with a new title?

#17 Zapper Zaku

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Posted 26 March 2011 - 01:51 AM

Last Episode. *sniff*



It's time for the celestrial armour fight in space!

Ha ha! Cao Cao's armour blew up.

And there's Cao Pi and red Sima Yi. I really do hope they make another series 'cause I want to see the Sima kids too.

Man, the Sun clan has about a million graves... Dang it! I think Yu died again.

I got a little teary eyed with the recap credits at the end.

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#18 HellCat

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Posted 27 March 2011 - 07:05 AM

I have to say if this is the ending, I'm really dissapointed. So many things were built up to and then thrown away. Why were Ryofu and Sousou established as Lords if one would kill the other and then in turn be killed himself by the other two? Why was Sazabi implied to have some hidden agenda and in turn why add that bit with him and Souhi at the end? Why have Bachou declare he was going to become a travelling hero too if his starring moments will now never be seen? Why introduce Kanpei beyond seemingly a reason to trot out another model kit and in kind Doven Wolf? ETC

It just seems like the series was a really half baked concept. It was going somewhere early on but it kept losing pace by constant fighting over the seal rather then sieze on Sangokuden's original elements? It was a bit of fun and gave me some nice avatars but ultimately it's messy, like they took the Sangokuden story, hollowed it out and threw stuff into the shell.

#19 HellCat

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Posted 30 March 2011 - 07:31 AM

Funny for all the complaining I've done, the sidestory this month made me like the ending more. It's the first piece of media I've seen run with the 'The SD Gundams are putting on a show' aspect in ages. The 'actress' GP-04 who plays Gerbera goes behind the scenes on the final episode to interview the actors. We find out such amusing things as ZZ and GP02 are wild drunks off camera and Zeta Plus has a ton of fangirls. At the centre of it all is RX-78-2, who is humbily playing Ryuubi.

#20 Zapper Zaku

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 05:45 PM

I've seen keeping a look out for anything about another Sangokuden series (or something!!). So far I did find it listed on someone's youtube page for upcoming anime for this summer. Still nothing official yet. But maybe.

I'm still sad about the box set being Bluray and all. T_T I still want the action figures too.

While I was searching, I came across some of the old sd gundam cartoons. I had seen some of the subbed ones before a few years ago (the ones with Onmitsu are my favorite) but I did watch some that I hadn't seen before too. I really like the one with Command, Musha and Knight Gundam. Nice to see SDGF's roots. Looks like the musha is again the butt of most of the jokes and command is afraid of cats?? Knight gundam rocks, though.

My favorite out of the ones I hadn't seen before has got to be this one. Since when was there a Gundam rock band!?!



Hey, does anyone know the name of the dragon-looking gundam guy getting annoyed by the band? I like him but I'm having trouble finding anything about who he is.

Edited by Zapper Zaku, 23 April 2011 - 05:50 PM.


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