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@  Verity Carlo : (24 August 2016 - 06:58 PM)

I've seen Minority Report, I don't want to read the same thing except with superheroes and also shit

@  Verity Carlo : (24 August 2016 - 06:57 PM)

You know, what I hate about Civil War II the most is that it's not even trying to break out of the Minority Report shaped hole it's in.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 02:39 PM)

the debate sems to be over.

@  MEDdMI : (24 August 2016 - 02:37 PM)

Wouldn't it be easier to debate this in the comics subforum?

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 01:31 PM)

I don't have anything else to say (although I still think G2 is the true ending, even if G I Joe doesn't mention it, it seems G I Joe/G2 crossover isn't canon for G I Joe comics but only for the Transformers continuity)

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 01:29 PM)

ok whatever you won.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 01:27 PM)

that's why I said "if", I dunno I didn't read G2 or G I Joe. 

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 01:26 PM)

Also,you're still basing this entirely on G2 matching a storyline that was part of G2 itself rather than whether or not G2 matches better with the G1 comic proper.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 01:24 PM)

The idea kind of falls apart when it requires that the apocalyptic alien invasions had such little impact that everyone easily just ignored forever.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 01:17 PM)

If some issues of G I Joe comics is a prelude to G2 and if there's nothing in the future G I Joe stories that condradicts San Francisco getting destroyed, yes I would say they share a continuity. 

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 01:02 PM)

If you're gonna go "we can assume it did happen even though it's never talked about as long as nothing specifically contradicts it", then surely it's just as easy to assume that the actual G1 TF and Joe crossover happened in the backstory of Classics and RG1.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 01:02 PM)

also I refrained from mentioning Ask Vector Prime but but didn't it say RG1 is a splinter timeline?

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 12:58 PM)

has san francisco ever appeared in G I Joe stories that was chronologically set after G2?

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:55 PM)

Intent is not the same as result. And comics end up ignoring things quite often.

@  Telly : (24 August 2016 - 12:54 PM)

maybe they figured a lot of people that read gi joe also read transformers. so they throw a crossover/build up in their to get some excitement for the new comic coming

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 12:51 PM)

If G2 universe was to be unrelated to G I Joe, why did they do a prelude to it?

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:33 PM)

Classics and RG1 not including Joe issues 138-145 in their backstory does not preclude them from including TF 1-80, or even the Joe and TF miniseries.

@  TheMightyMol... : (24 August 2016 - 12:30 PM)

Marvel 616 is also a massive continuity snarl from dozens of writers altering, retconning, or ignoring each others' work for decades, so it's not really a great example for an argument on continuity.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 12:29 PM)

Marvel 616 continuity is a shared universe, devastating events happens in individual series but does mean every event gets mentioned in other comics? @Notvery knightly, yeah that's why I edited that post.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:27 PM)

Your proof for "TF universe = Joe universe" itself is the G2 lead-up, so your reasoning still goes back to G2 matching G2.

@  TheMightyMol... : (24 August 2016 - 12:25 PM)

So did GI Joe ever reference the time Bludgeon sent his entire force to rampage across the Earth? Or the time Jhiaxus blew San Francisco into a crater?

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 12:25 PM)

whatever.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:22 PM)

Are you not seeing the recursiveness of "G2 is the true G1 sequel because G2 follows up on a G2 storyline"?

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 12:18 PM)

Yeah it has been established that Marvel Transformers and G I Joe comics takes place in the same universe. Unless 90s G I Joe was a reboot I'm pretty sure the G2 crossing over to a G I Joe comic that takes place in the very same universe as the original Transformers makes G2 the canon ending.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:16 PM)

A crossover that the Joe comic apparently ignored.

@  Arazyr : (24 August 2016 - 12:15 PM)

They had a crossover before that, 1986. http://tfwiki.net/wi...he_Transformers

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:15 PM)

Did G.I. Joe acknowledge the planet getting wrecked by the Swarm? Because otherwise it's more like "Marvel Transformers is the same universe as Marvel G.I. Joe only when they feel like it".

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 12:11 PM)

You're using the G.I. Joe G2 prequel itself as the basis for "Marvel Transformers universe is the same universe as the Marvel G I Joe", which makes this a rather loopy argument.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 12:07 PM)

As I said before, Marvel Transformers universe is the same universe as the Marvel G I Joe. Marvel G I Joe crossovers with G2, which makes G2 the canon ending. 

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 11:59 AM)

How is that relevant to whether or not RG1 (or Classics, even) takes place after issues 1 through 80 of Marvel TF proper?

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 11:51 AM)

it's a prequel to G2, which makes it the same universe as G2.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 11:48 AM)

That's clearly not in G2 itself, seeing as it's G.I. Joe issue 138.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 11:45 AM)

@NotVrtyKnightly Im talking about these issues. http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Unfoldings!

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (24 August 2016 - 11:30 AM)

Now for my part, I consider Marvel G2/Alignment the "true" ending because of Simon Furman's involvement in it, its continuous narrative with Marvel G1, and its sequential publication.

@  SHIELD Agent 47 : (24 August 2016 - 11:28 AM)

The nature of multiple spinoffs/branching timelines means that to call any one spinoff the "true" ending is an arbitrary decision.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 11:16 AM)

Joe doesn't take place "in G2". Even their Marvel TF-related history isn't confined entirely to a single publication from the 90s.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 11:08 AM)

Look, oirignal Marvel Transformers takes place in the same universe as G I Joe and G I Joe takes place in the same universe as G2, which makes G2 the true canon ending.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 11:07 AM)

And it's not like anyone would argue that Rebirth wasn't actually the fourth season of the Sunbow cartoon entirely based on the lack of Ramirez and Old Snake.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 11:07 AM)

No you don't get it, I'm not saying RG1 is "less true" because G I Joe doesn't show up.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 10:54 AM)

Also, it's set decades later and earth was wrecked. Surely you don't need an explanation of why the Joes don't show up.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 10:53 AM)

None of that makes RG1 less "true".

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 10:41 AM)

How is it odd? G I joe and Transformers are canonically in the same continuty. Marvel Transformers continuity is a shared universe. G I Joe is canon and they had a crossover with G2, which makes it canon too, simple as that.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 09:30 AM)

an odd thing to say, surely.

@  NotVeryKnightly : (24 August 2016 - 09:30 AM)

If you haven't read them, picking one over the other because of the presence of G.I. Joes is just

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 09:24 AM)

Also even though it's not officially published, I believe Alignment is canon since it was referenced in Ask Vector Prime and Allspark Almanac.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 09:22 AM)

I don't have an opinion on neither G2 or RG1 since I didn't read them.

@  Dracula : (24 August 2016 - 07:54 AM)

G2 was kind of miserable but even that is preferable to RG1.

@  tffan01 : (24 August 2016 - 07:14 AM)

I don't think RG1 is the true ending to the Marvel because G. I Joe was in the same continuity as Transformers and they had a crossover with G2, not RG1 (obviously RG1 didn't exist back then). So G2/Alignment is the true ending.

@  TheMightyMol... : (24 August 2016 - 02:20 AM)

Why do you hate yourself?

@  LBD "Nyt... : (24 August 2016 - 12:45 AM)

I still need to read everything after Vol. 1 of RG1...


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JK Rowling turned down for Presidential Medal of Freedom


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88 replies to this topic

#21 Mark Pellegrini

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 02:21 PM

Disregarding Bush's reason for dismissing her, the woman wrote some popular but mediocre kids books. She doesn't deserve every award on the ****ing planet.

I'm sure England will Knight her or make her a Commander of the British Empire like they do with most of their celebrities who make it big in the US. So what's one Presidential Medal of Freedom to her?

#22 ShadowMan024

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 02:22 PM

Well, it'd be another few karats of gold to amount to... I have no idea how much gold. But hey. At least they didn't consider giving it to Meyer... Even though knowing Bush, he just might have thought about it.

And thanks. Just because iot's classic, doesn't mean it's "OMG THE BEST." There are some classics that stand the test of time, like Edgar Allen Poe. Harper Lee... Eh. TKaM just is a slightly- above-average book that was groundbreaking for it's time. Sure, it had some good parts "Joe Robison's trial, the racist getting killed, any time Boo Radley is involved), but... Eh. It just doesn't reel me in like Fahrenheit 451 or The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe did. I'm more of a sci-fi/fantasy guy when it comes to literature, and, when it comes to books in general, I like fact books about animals, dinosaurs, and space, along with collections of folklore.

Edited by Spin-Out!, 30 September 2009 - 02:25 PM.

Transformers is a brand that really has something for everyone. We are a darn lucky fandom.


#23 Shadewing

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 02:24 PM

QUOTE(Esser-Z @ Sep 30 2009, 02:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Spin-Out! @ Sep 30 2009, 03:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Esser-Z @ Sep 30 2009, 03:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(wonko the sane? @ Sep 30 2009, 03:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Esser-Z @ Sep 30 2009, 03:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The reason is, of course, totally insane. But I don't think she deserves a medal. She wrote...a good (but not great!) series of books? Woo?

She got an entire generation of children to read. While her stories aren't really noteworthy, the results are.

Twilight also gets people to read! Shudder.

Thing is, as Stephen King put it, J.K Rowling is a good writer, and Meyer... Well, we all chagrinning know how chagrinning bad she chagrinning is.

Also, chagrin.

My point is that 'getting people to read' is, alone, not enough. icon-waspy.gif


Getting people to read is the first step. Good or bad, if you can get someone to like to read then they will hopefillu expand their horizons eventually. Even if its just switching Twilight for Interview with a Vampire; its still a step up from where they where/

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#24 MrBlud

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 02:24 PM

I thought "To Kill A Mockingbird" was very interesting, even today.

You want mind-numbing boredom read "A Separate Peace."

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#25 ShadowMan024

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 02:31 PM

Eh, as with anything, it's all a matter of opinion.

Transformers is a brand that really has something for everyone. We are a darn lucky fandom.


#26 The Ambassador

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 02:41 PM

I think the trouble is you're usually forced at knifepoint to read literature in school. A lot of it is incredibly dry and mind-numbingly dull, despite some solid gems out there. I would never read Of Mice and Men for pleasure, but I am glad that I did read it, as it's still a solid tale told rather well.

It depends, really. I read for my own enjoyment, and I do read a lot of trashy pulp, although I like to think my tastes have improved (To be fair, it would have been hard for them to go downwards). That isn't to say I don't read something with a bit of heft (I'm forcing myself through The Iliad), but I prefer to read things I enjoy.
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#27 Bleargh001

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 02:43 PM

QUOTE(MrBlud @ Sep 30 2009, 12:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I thought "To Kill A Mockingbird" was very interesting, even today.

You want mind-numbing boredom read "A Separate Peace."



I couldn't be more in agreement with you on both counts.

Grapes of Wrath was also good.

#28 Crypt

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 02:49 PM

QUOTE(MrBlud @ Sep 30 2009, 03:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I thought "To Kill A Mockingbird" was very interesting, even today.

You want mind-numbing boredom read "A Separate Peace."


I loved that book.

#29 ShadowMan024

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 02:50 PM

Man, on any other forum, this would have degenerated into a flamewar by now. But not here on the 'Spark icon-fire.gif

Transformers is a brand that really has something for everyone. We are a darn lucky fandom.


#30 Cabooceratops

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 02:56 PM

QUOTE(The Ambassador @ Sep 30 2009, 03:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I think the trouble is you're usually forced at knifepoint to read literature in school. A lot of it is incredibly dry and mind-numbingly dull, despite some solid gems out there. I would never read Of Mice and Men for pleasure, but I am glad that I did read it, as it's still a solid tale told rather well.

Oh indeed, I loved that book, wouldn't have read it if it wasn't for school.

I also enjoyed Jules Verne's "Journey to the Center of the Earth".

#31 Shadewing

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 02:58 PM

QUOTE(Spin-Out! @ Sep 30 2009, 02:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Man, on any other forum, this would have degenerated into a flamewar by now. But not here on the 'Spark icon-fire.gif


Thatss what I love about this place. It's not just a messageboard or forum, its a real comuninity. We can have discussions over everything, and it tends to remain remarkably civil. Even when there are several posts talking about how they don't like somethgin, it almost never a slur against someone else. It just amazes me how remarkibly diffrent this place is to other places around the 'net.

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#32 Shadewing

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 03:00 PM

QUOTE(Caboose! @ Sep 30 2009, 02:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(The Ambassador @ Sep 30 2009, 03:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I think the trouble is you're usually forced at knifepoint to read literature in school. A lot of it is incredibly dry and mind-numbingly dull, despite some solid gems out there. I would never read Of Mice and Men for pleasure, but I am glad that I did read it, as it's still a solid tale told rather well.

Oh indeed, I loved that book, wouldn't have read it if it wasn't for school.

I also enjoyed Jules Verne's "Journey to the Center of the Earth".


I third the love for 'Of Mice and Men', one of the few books I was glad to be 'forced' to read.

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#33 Bocc Kob

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 03:02 PM

I liked Of Mice And Men and To Kill A Mockingbird, but I still don't get why either is considered a must-read classic. Is there a specific criteria for this or something?

#34 Internet Jesus

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 03:22 PM

Yeah, I think the Reads-Like-A-Badly-Written-Fanfic nature of the last two books disqualifies her for the Medal of WTF.

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#35 Col. Jupiter

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 04:19 PM

QUOTE(Database @ Sep 30 2009, 04:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(Caboose! @ Sep 30 2009, 02:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(The Ambassador @ Sep 30 2009, 03:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I think the trouble is you're usually forced at knifepoint to read literature in school. A lot of it is incredibly dry and mind-numbingly dull, despite some solid gems out there. I would never read Of Mice and Men for pleasure, but I am glad that I did read it, as it's still a solid tale told rather well.

Oh indeed, I loved that book, wouldn't have read it if it wasn't for school.

I also enjoyed Jules Verne's "Journey to the Center of the Earth".


I third the love for 'Of Mice and Men', one of the few books I was glad to be 'forced' to read.


Of Mice and Men is one of my favorite books of all time. It succeeds at everything Grapes of Wrath tried to do, and in a fraction of the pages.



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#36 ShadowMan024

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 04:28 PM

See, I was foced to read Fahrenheit 451 for school. And I loved it. I think Of Mice and Men may be one of the books required for English this year, so maybe I'll read that.

Transformers is a brand that really has something for everyone. We are a darn lucky fandom.


#37 mx-01 archon

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 04:33 PM

I loved Fahrenheit 451, except for its non-ending. Sure, it was an ending for Montag's character arc, which was really the point of the whole thing, but for the world and narrative that had been established thus far, it felt a bit lacking in other regards. It was a season finale, not a series finale, if you were.

#38 Bocc Kob

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 04:49 PM

I can't remember anything about that book except for the book burning guy getting chased by a robot dog.

#39 Mark Pellegrini

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 05:03 PM

In regards to mandatory literature from high school, I detested the really dry stuff like the aforementioned "To Kill a Kockingbird", "Of Mice and Men" and so on. The stuff I really enjoyed were the more fantasy-oriented books, like "Beowulf" and "The Odyssey". We were supposed to read "Journey to the West" my senior year, but we ran out of time, so I read it on my own and thoroughly enjoyed it.

"Fahrenheit 451" and "1984" I recall reading but feeling mostly apathetic about. I actually don't remember them all that well. They were probably the most modern books they let us read in school. It really irritated me that we weren't permitted to read any modern literature, as if a book being written within the past three decades somehow makes it "bad". Would've loved to have read some Bradbury when I was in school...


Public school curiculum did ONE thing for me, though. I now and forever will have a seething hatred toward the works of William Shakespeare. Perhaps if we'd only read one or two of his plays, I might not hate him so much. But 11th grade literature curiculum in Fairfax County was "all Shakespeare, all the time". We read Romeo & Juliet, Taming of the Shrew, Julius Caesar, Macbeth and Hamlet among others! We spent that ENTIRE year reading nothing BUT Shakespeare.

And the cramming of the immortal bard down our throats didn't begin or end with the 11th grade. I recall in my 8th grade creative writing class, we only actually wrote two stories. So what'd we do during that class if we didn't write? We had to memorize Shakespearian sonnets and recite them. That's what we did. Every day. Instead of writing.

Then there's all the other Shakespeare stories I had to read during different years. I actually wound up reading Romeo & Juliet THREE times between middle school and high school!

And don't even get me started on the fact that the man wrote PLAYS that were meant to be WATCHED, not READ. BLAAAAAARRRGH!


I hate that guy. I hate his plays. If I go the rest of my life without reading anything he penned, it'll be too soon.

#40 mx-01 archon

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Posted 30 September 2009 - 05:09 PM

QUOTE(DrSpengler @ Sep 30 2009, 03:03 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
"Fahrenheit 451" ...Would've loved to have read some Bradbury when I was in school...


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