http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/videolink...-generation-2-1

Welcome to Atop The Fourth Wall where good Transformers comics burn!

Feel free to skip the first five minutes since its all padding up until then.

He spends too much on Blades killing the guy surrendering who was going to kill Hound. Its all explained later yet he just brushes over it despite his rant earlier.

Wonder if he'll be going bankrupt soon because of adblock.

Oh he still hasnt learned to balance his audio. Oh.

you're autocorrect seems to be messing up; this ISN'T a good comic. This is a slow boring comic, that is fueled by every bad 90's trope and all the worst parts of Furman's writing, not that Furman has much GOOD writing imo but this is sub-par even for him.

Yeah, the G2 comic is massively overrated, especially the first bunch of issues.

I still get a kick out of reading it every now and again for camp value (same reason I own the sole issue of Alister The Slayer!) but to say it's a good comic is a very, very, very silly thing to say.

So is yours.



But seriously, I like the G2 comics. They're not as good as Furman's run on the U.S. G1 comics of course, but they're still better, to me at least, than Budiansky's entire run.

i do love me dat Yaniger/Senior art from the geetoo comics tho

<3

I'd call it a very 90s Transformers comic. But it's still one I enjoyed at the time and still enjoy despite it now. It was awesome to see Furman's TFs back and trying for an at least incrementally more serious direction.

-ZacWilliam, other than Manny Galan's art (uch) G2 was and remains really pretty cool IMO

Yaniger's art is Liefeld in robot form. I don't see any redeeming value beyond looking XTREEEM and GRITTY and NECKWIRES. There's no proper sense of perspective and everyone's got the ugliest faces EVER.

Manny Galan often takes flak for "being bad", but aside from his poor attempt at aping Yaniger's style... but he did it with a much finer technique, with proper respect given towards proportions and perspective and it wasn't all IMAGE COMICS IN YO FACE XTREEEEEEEEM DUDE.


Senior was in prime form as usual, though.

I like to imagine what G2 would be like if it had more traditional artwork and character designs. And G2 color schemes for those who appeared in G2.

Yaniger's art was like animated's it was pretty much a poppet sort of thing.

Your right though that shouldn't deny the importance of perspective and such. But, I love the feel he gave the books.

But I mostly like it more for the fact that it had this very punk tyPe of feel to it. The gritty part used to appeal to me. But now that feels expressively depressing about it.


But really, I'd love to see g2 revisited. But with better storytelling, art that captures what I liked about Yaniger. And an explanation for the weird colors.


Honestly, the united Autobots and Cons could be seen as communal anarchists fighting against the liege Maximo's corrupt imperialism. Just this justifies the garishness of the toys. I meant its Transformers gone anarchist punk.


And it works. Prime and Meg's come to realize their war will never end. Order can't be exactly established. So they become communal anarchists. With the Autobots being more peaceful. But still the idea of non-totalitarian anti hero Decepticons who actually now are good guys somewhat... Is awesome.


I mean you can look at the color schemes as individualistic sel expression. And now that there was a huger hand to rebel against. The autobots and decepticons no longer symbolize regime. I like the idea of g2 turning them into nomadic space tribes with different government ideals.

Ideally the liege Maximo wouldn't be someone that could be stopped. But delayed and slowed down. The Decepticons would still live for war and conquest. But their military doctrine would change and they'd develop a bit of a moral conscience. But they'd still have difference of opinion between them and the autobots.

Gotta disagree.

Yes Yaniger was very stylized and very 90s but at least he owned that art style. It was strong and artistic, dynamic and "his". You might not like the art style, and I can totally understand that, but he handled it well as it could be done IMO. It felt like big quality comic book art. Had solid, if exagerated, graphic design sense behind it. It's IMMENSELY more appealing then Galan ever was IMO.

Galan comes off, in every issue and every panel, as someone who would be a very mediocure, low quality, and boring comic book artist on his own, trying very badly to ape someone else's distinctive style. The end result was bland, lack of detail and softness, and a realy imature and ugly attempt at Yaniger that looses everything positive about Yan's art while retaining deformity and ugliness to figures and faces. It's now just bland, under-detailed, far below published comic quality ugliness.


-ZacWilliam, I'd take Yanigers extreme 90's stylization over Galan's bland rounded underdetailed amateur level work any day.

That's why I said that you can say it was like pop art. Maybe I'm using the wrong term but it was forgivably stylized and fit the feel of the story.

Sure now the 90's guns akimbo thing from back then is very 90's. But I feel like g2 pulls it in a nostalgic way. Like it was symptomatic of the times. And not just them apeing it to get new readers. Although it honestly was that heh.


Still it worked for me. I just don't feel the grim and gritty reflects well on transformers as a long term thing. It should be a subtle influence.

So how long does he go one THIS TIME?

I didn't bother with his video about 2 issues of Dreamwave TF because it went on to/about/past half an hour.

Still, I like his "History of Power Rangers" videoes.

I think you need to actually go back and look at some of Galan's work. Respect to proportion and perspective?

Glad there is someone else who calls out Furman on his jive and his jivey writing.

Oh no, one panel where it gets awkward. It's really no worse than Yaniger's usual stuff, but unlike Yaniger there's a bigger pool of more technically sound art in places he's less apey of Yaniger.
Hell, when he's not aping Yaniger he can do some really good faces, too!
http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Image:Infernoescalation.jpg
I'll take this over Yaniger's big-chinned snarls, thank ye very much.

I agree that there are some good and fun parts in G2 comics, my favorite being the stuff with Starscream and the Matrix, but most the stuff, including this first issue, is far from being good; and the only reason I feel some of you think it is is because 1. Nostalgia 2. its Transformers. To me, much of Furman's stuff is vastly overrated.

Good?

SOMEONE ON THE INTERNETS HAS A DIFFERENT OPINION THAN ME... BEES MY GOD!

I always find it difficult to review G2 on its merits because it's definitely #1 in the nostalgia spot for me, being my first foray into Transformers. Thinking about the plot of the first few issues (mainly just people killing each other for minimal reasons with some set-up for the Cybertronian Empire thrown in), it is pretty bad.

Really don't understand Detour's hate for Yaniger, though. Sure, it's overstylized, but in a good way. I'll have to look back but I don't remember any problems with proportion/perspective. Time for me to look back at the art methinks. Now, Manny Galan... I still have that one panel with Prime having a Lee-style neck length of nothing but cables burned into my memory.



Yeah, listening to Linkara... I get this isn't a good comic, but man he likes to make some silly complaints. "Where do they keep those giant guns in their alt-modes?" "When did the Decepticons become construction workers?" "What's up with the little triangles in the speech bubbles?" ...Really? And the problem you pointed out is pretty bad. He cuts to TFTM and says "you wanna bring that one up?" No, I don't, how about we bring up the fact the Decepticon was armed, as explained two pages later?

The triangle and square speech signifiers were great. I wish they'd come back, but it probably takes a lot of extra work.

He was nit-picking there for the sake of nit-picking. Why is it that when I am familar with the subject in a review by these entertainment reviewers, I tend to disagree with them? Its a lot more obvious where they are nit-picking or blowing something minor up into something much bigger for the sake of a joke or criticism? AVGN, Nostalgia Critic and Yahtzee have done this. I prefer reviews where I am unfamilar with the subject.

Linkara has a few major points I disagree with or aren't that big of a deal.

Blades was in character here. Thats who he is. I always assumed Blades knew that the Cybertronian was armed but that Hound (and the reader) did not until a few pages later. Even to a new reader, it should be clear by Hound's reactions and the rest of the Autobots later that Blades is a one off jerk. Yet Linkara rants about Blades actions as being common amongst the Autobots and as I said, quickly rushes past the reveal that the Cybertronian wasn't unarmed as previously thought.

Too much emphasis was placed on it not being a continuation. Clearly the comic was a continuation and that a comment from Furman in the letters page was an exaggeration or not meant to be taken literally. Its a reboot at most with a new chapter to the continuity, not a completely new continuity. But why let facts get in the way of criticism, eh?

Ii didn't like the art or big guns either when I first read G2. I got used to them though and overlook its ridiculousness. It was the 90s after all and G2 was a product of its time. Not really a bad thing. If I were to redraw the comics personally though, I'd make the art and the weapons more traditional.

Linkara is the single most pedantic and self important reviewer around. His fame (notoriety?) went to his head and now seems to fancy himself the foremost expert on everything. Even stuff he's not familiar with. I stopped watching him a long time ago and I'm not even going to dignify this with a view. G2 wasn't perfect, but if nothing else it gave us Jhiaxus and the Swarm. For all its flaws and weird art and 90's "flavah", it does not belong in the same category as Dreamwave's early G1 stuff or Dark Knight Strikes Again.

Yeah, I mean, the GRITTINESS and HUGE GUNS and stuff are bad, like most 90s stuff. Panels of people shooting stuff off screen isn't as exciting as a real fight scene, I get that. I don't think Marvel at the time was trying to be ironic, I think they were trying to cash in on the 90s-era popularity. But still, there's a certain ironic charm about it all, probably because it's so hilariously over the top (I kinda think Yaniger knew that, just look at some of those gun designs). Whereas Dreamwave G1 is just cringe-inducing until you get to the So Bad It's Hilarious stuff like the vast amounts of DULL SURPRSE.

And yeah, I really do love those squares and triangles. I thought they were a neat touch that set the Transformers apart, personally. It still looks weird to me to see Transformers talking in round speech bubbles like humans in every other comic - I got used to the shapes (and the "spark corners" in the G1 comic).

He's got a voice that's great for text reviews.

I think Generation 2 stands better as a whole, the sum of its parts, rather than as individual entries.

Also, the big guns don't bother me. In fact, there's never been a better place for them... just take another look at some of the toys sometime, from Targetmaster Hot Rod to... well, a good chunk of G2, actually. Remember all those huge missile launchers, which aren't even all that uncommon today? Jazz and Sideswipe's, for example?

Transformers was practically made for that stuff.

--LBD "Nytetrayn"

Man, he really didn't USED to be, though. Used to really enjoy him. But now it's turned into half-hour reviews for a single comic with ten minutes of Power Ranger dress-up live-action fanfic, and you're so, SO right with that "foremost expert" stuff - he's always being called in by other reviewers if they do something associated with a comic, even if he *knows nothing about that comic*, just because he's the "comic guy".

I skip past all the fanfic stuff. Just doesn't appeal to me. I do still enjoy his comic reviews though.

I see Linkara is still an idiot.

Some things never change.

Whether or not you actually think the G2 comic is GOOD, it struck me that a lot of Linkara's complaints here showed that he just didn't frickin' understand the comic he was reading.

He goes on and on about the Autobots looking like the bad guys when... THAT'S THE THEME OF THE COMIC. He even goes out of his way to ignore or downplay this -- like with the Blades thing. It's hard to tell the Autobots from the Decepticons? Well done son, you've identified what the comic is ABOUT. Yuzzah for you.

He's kinda right in his 'this comic isn't for new readers' complaint... it's certainly not for new readers by TODAY'S standard where you're not allowed to have ANYTHING that makes a backwards reference or OH NOES! NEW READERS WON'T GET IT! By 90s standards, though? I think it's pretty open and obvious. Characters are identified by name, there's flashbacks to show the status quo, and we get some pretty explicit dialogue setting up the themes and setting of the series.

I did cringe a few times at stuff that was more forgiveable -- ignorance of the Transformers brand. Like when he complains about the giant guns. Y'know, the giant guns that were styled after the giant guns that the G2 toys *had*. He even specifically complains about the giant missile launcher Optimus Prime has in the cover spread, asking where he'd put that in vehicle mode. Which... uhhh... that missile launcher is the TOY'S missile launcher. Y'know, the one that stores on his voice box unit in vehicle mode? But it's kinda hard to find out these things. You'd have to actually look up the Generation 2 toys, or actually ask a TF fan about these things and then you'd have nothing to bitch about in your review!

The fact that his complaints come out to, "I hate the 90s art style" and "I didn't understand the themes of this book" it makes me wonder how carefully he reads other comics he's, uhhh... "Reviewing".

I still enjoy Linkara's stuff to a certain extent -- but mostly when he's talking about stuff he's comfortable with, like DC and 90s Image comics. When he steps outside his comfort zone he's pretty awful.

--Andrew S.

They're for entertainment, not serious reviews. That includes Nostalgia Critic and AVGN. Its only obvious when you know the subject that's being reviewed. Otherwise I enjoy being taken for the ride.

I own a copy of Sonic Live! (...or I used to, I don't know where it is and that may mean it got destroyed at some point), which Linkara also wasn't familiar with, and his review of that is pretty spot-on.

coolstorybro.jpg

Amen. I can barely stand listening to his reviews because of his voice.

I have to laugh when he complains about where a tractor trailer would store something in vehicle mode.

Otherwise, that's half an hour of my life I'll never have back. He overacts and his voice feels like I'm being punched in the ear drum.

I did rather enjoy his recent review of Captain Tax Return, or whatever it was called, as did my wife.

Of course, the surprise that it turned out to be a Canadian book just made it all the better...

--LBD "Nytetrayn"

His best work was reviewing The Ultimate Warrior's bizarre crap from the '90s.

Well, he also had Spoony with him for that. And Ultimate Warrior is a freakin' treasure trove of insane unintentional comedy. That kind of makes the whole deal a VERY high hurdle to clear.

I think people are missing that Linkara, along with many-slash-most reviewers on the TGWTG aggregate, are comedic reviewers and often playing characters to varying degrees, and as such, generally exaggerate complaints and self-depreciating traits for effect. Linkara frequently plays up the "nitpicky comic nerd" angle, even moreso in crossovers with other reviewers. The whole point of AT4W is to pick a comic apart bit by bit.

As it stands, I'm not seeing much here different in tone than his review of Dreamwave's TF output (a review I quite enjoyed), outside of the justifiable contempt for the GRITTY 90S AWESOME that G2 was dripping with. I can't help but wonder how much "this is a thing I like/have fond memories of" plays in here. (Let's be honest, trashing Pat Lee is kind of an accepted pastime in TF fandom.)

I think it's also fair to point out that yes, he's right in that the story's heavy backstory ties CAN be confusing despite Furman's protestations to the contrary and the vaguest of references in that like one flashback page... because I sure was confused back when I first read this. I'd stopped reading the old Marvel books shortly after the Club Con arc (but before #50, I'd not read the Underbase proper part), I'd not yet started hunting down the past issues... and going into G2, the first TF comic I'd read in years... I had no idea what the hell was going on with some of these returning plot threads. I had no idea who Bludgeon was or why he was important, or why, for that matter, he wasn't a robot. That barely even gets touched on when something directly related to that happens in the comic! In places it was kind of assumed you'd been around for the tail-end of the original run, like with Starscream being on the Ark for Megatron to revive.

And holy crap is Hot Rod UGLY. And I can't help but think that the oversized ridiculous hand-grenade-having-guns would be there regardless of whatever a small handful of toys had.

So yeah. I'm not getting the hate-on for this review. Maybe it's jsut that I'm not fond of the G2 comic; I don't hate it, but it's kind of a period I'd rather forget outside of creating a ridiculous parody of it. I generally enjoy Linkara's work, though admittedly, I tend to prefer his looks at the obscure and weird, like the aforementioned "Captain Tax Time" comic, "Black Web", that weirdass kung-fu thing from a few episodes back, "Bimbos In Time", and such. And the occasional foray into taking down this Big Boys (Identity Crisis), though that kind of ties into my own distaste for recentish comic trends.


M "But Then Again, I've Always Had A Hard Time Seeing The Point In Getting Upset At Reviews Of TF Media" Sipher

Yeah, Yaniger art is not necessarily good art. Distinctive? Definitely? Characterful as all get-out? Nobody would debate that. It's just not... conventionally good.

Yeah, his inability to understand the basic, straightforward theme of the issue pretty much invalidates the review in my opinion. It's such a good theme too... part of what really drew me into the comic.

I agree with his complaint about the human-faced Transformer inside the fold-out cover. There's a lot about that cover always confused me...

http://www.unicron.us/tf1993/comics/cover1b.jpg

Why are miscolored Skyscorchers there? They don't even appear in the series. In fact, the human-faced Decepticon looks a lot like Terradive's head. The intention was probably to show that beneath their "window" faces, they had normal Transformers faces, but the colorist misinterpreted it.

Is that supposed to be Ramjet up-side-down in the background, with all those randomly incorrect details?

Is that a mis-colored, mis-allegianced Sideswipe or is it supposed to be G2 Breakdown? Either one is a bit of an anomoly....

Why is one of Optimus's guns based off his G2 toy guns, when they don't appear anywhere else in the series?

I had always assumed the guy with a human face was supposed to be a Decepticon Pretender (with the artist not realizing the Decepticon Pretenders were all monsters, not humans like the Autobots). But you're right, looks like he could be Terradive with a face under the visor that got miscolored. And everyone else there is a G2 toy (except possibly that mystery Sideswipe/Breakdown).

The Decepticon Pretenders weren't all monsters.

I've always really liked Yaniger's art. It was super roboticky, in a fun way. It was really the first time anyone ever drew off-model on purpose, and it was amazing at the time.

I got into some arguments over there against my better judgement - but seriously, some of the ignorant comments ( the ones on the "Haha, look at how bad TF comics are!" level) really got me riled up.

And Linkara lingers too much on that one letter page comment from Furman that this is a comic that can stand on its own without need to read G1. For a guy who reviews comics for a living, he is sure not in the known about advertising... Pretty much all authors HAVE to say this, and not "You better read all 80 issues of Marvel US and some of Marvel UK to get to understand everything". Publishers would not be thrilled about the truth.



Starscream and Stranglehold weren't, but the others... Thunderwing is (supposed to be) an Oni, and while I am not sure what the heck Roadblock is, he is certainly monstrous. So I am OK with that.

I also can't understand how he missed the fact that Jhiaxus and co. left Cybertron while Prime and Megatron were deactivated on Earth, when the comic says that explicitely, and he even adressed Straxus's cameo.



Bravo for putting that down so simply! That's what most of the commentators did not get either. But seriously, anyone who knows the bots under Grimlock's leadership would know that they are the kind of guys who are not fond of the whole 'mercy' thing. Broadside is an ex-Wrecker, Blades would chop Cons up with his rotorblades if he could detach them, and Sideswipe was even a 'run straight at the enemy' warrior in the cartoon.

I really wish they'd bring back the square-shaped Marvel style bubbles. Whenever I draw TF-related parody comics, I still use those. And they are especially good in comics involving humans, as it makes easier to identify who's talking.

On the other hand, Transformers had been off the shelves for two years, and now it was appearing in the form of a #1, to promote a relaunched toyline that implicitly assumed newbies. That would be a really good time for "this comic can stand on your own, you don't need to have read 80 issues of previous continuity" to actually be true. It's not a great time to go continuity-heavy. And it's a terrible time to rely on your readers knowing "but if you were familiar with G1, you'd know that these particular Autobots are exceptions, and most of the others all act really heroic!"

That's still amply explained within this same issue, where Prime muses that without a Decepticon threat, the Autobots have become directionless, perhaps even dangerous since they no longer have the war they fought for centuries.

Maybe if it'd been written by someone better than Furman it wouldn't be a case of needing to know fricken past, or you know.. might know how to write something besides "Look at us being badass because we are so badass our asses are badass badasses! BADASS!"

Also maybe if it was written by someone other then Furman, the fanboys wouldn't have their panties in a twist. After all Furman is god and how dare someone criticize the subtle nuisances of his work.