Why do nerd girls love bad guys? Options

[NICKSAUR]

Joss Whedon generally makes more interesting villains than heroes.

Spike vs. Riley. Is it really a contest?

TRUTH!

A better comparison would be Angel vs. Spike. I mean, Riley's pretty drab anyways; even for a good guy.

[Adam G]

Joss Whedon generally makes more interesting villains than heroes.

Spike vs. Riley. Is it really a contest?

TRUTH!

A better comparison would be Angel vs. Spike. I mean, Riley's pretty drab anyways; even for a good guy.

True, but Angel is popular because of his bad side, not because of his broody mopey loser side.

[CORVUS]

Heh. I'm reminded of Wesley and Cordelia summing up the romance of Buffy and Angel for Fred's benefit. Good times (IMG:style_emoticons/default/icon-fire.gif)

[Stormrave]

the weird girls in love with Starscream and Megatron.

HEY

(Actually, I think Nickstart's nailed it. Villains are often more complex and interesting than heroes, and the villain has the uphill struggle, the underdog if you will, the one forced to come up with new plans while the heros fight to hold the status quo. I will personally add a certain amount of sympathy with Starscream as when I was growing up my wits were my best defense against much larger, more powerful, more aggressive people I had to live with.)

[Draange]

I'm a nerd chick and I was swooning for Cap.

[Adam G]

I'm a nerd chick and I was swooning for Cap.

I'm a nerd guy who didn't even like his movie but I have a huge boner for Chris Evans.

[Cheetimus Primal]

I'm a nerd chick and I was swooning for Cap.

Yeah and you know you're one of my faves (IMG:style_emoticons/default/icon-hotrod.gif)

[MonsterFromMars]

I think theres a victim rescuer issue with it.

If girls feel guilty about their sexuality or no guy is interested in them. They start fantasizing a confident, sexually liberated male who is empowered, happy, confident, self loving, dosen't have any victim traits himself.

Heroes less face it have victim complexes and low self esteem a lot more of the time that's why they do good in the first place.


Villains are confident and dare to tread where others fear. I dont think it shows a sexual desire for bad boys so much as confident liberated men who know what they want.

Heros aren't like that. Heros may be confident but their overall lonely and insecure.

The unfourtunate is that villains are happy and loving out of narcissitic and sociopathic traits. A huge ego.


Insecure women are drawn to the villains love for himself and large ego because they themselves feel laid low. So they gravitate towards someone more happier and focused.


Women are looking for guys that make them feel good about themselves.

I guess women have mild inverted narcissism traits. So they gravitate sexually to narcissitic males.

This post has been edited by MonsterFromMars: May 8 2012, 06:15 PM

[Nyarlathotep]

I thought you weren't allowed to talk about girls.

[MonsterFromMars]

I agree the evil is sexy thing usually is due to mystery, far, hot body, abd leather clothes.

But I'd figure with supervillains there's that trait of how narcissitic personalities can be seductive to people.

Abd I think that's part of it in some cases.

[Adam G]

Heroes less face it have victim complexes and low self esteem a lot more of the time that's why they do good in the first place.

Sounds like Loki in Thor, the character the women in the OP would have been familiar with before going in to see the Avengers. Doesn't add up...

[TrentTroop]

Seriously, I do no understand this. There was a row of girls in front of us watching Avengers and they were swooning, even saying the word "swoon" out loud, over Loki and clapping when he did something evil.
I've seen this kind of thing throughout fandoms and a ton at anime conventions or the weird girls in love with Starscream and Megatron.

Why? Those are the bad guys! Tehy aren't going to love you back, they would sooner kill you! And why root for evil things?!

I just... don't get it.

I don't see this as a gender issue. Consider the classic male-centric love triangle. It's always the nice girl and the bad girl and while the nice girl usually winds up being the 'twue wuv', the bad girl is the one that's hot. I don't see how this would be any different for the ladytypes.

Any of the female G.I.-Joes verses the Baroness? C'mon.

-Trent

[Dissever]

Baroness is competent, and doesn't have any obnoxious personality traits, though. What /truly/ baffles me are the horrible male characters that do not have enough redeeming qualities to make them palatable -- heroic, villainous, or otherwise -- that STILL curry so much interest from female fans.

For the Avengers, Loki was essentially phoning it in (the moral of the story here being, 'don't be a male villain in a Whedon film, I guess) -- I really suspect that the gals described in the original post were carrying a flame from Loki's portrayal in the first movie, where he was highly motivated through the stinging development regarding his parentage. His villainy was much more understandable, and admirable in that setting. Out of Avengers, I would say that Hawkeye appealed the most to me in terms of characterization. We got to see him be competent under the influence of evil, but once free, express genuine remorse and perhaps even MORE impressively, still be competent AS A NON-SUPERPOWERED planner and participant in the team's rally against the forces of evil.

On the physical side of things, he is lean, and possesses Vitruvian proportions, which appeals greatly to me. Cap and Thor (Point Break, lol) are entirely too puffy, and frankly Banner (despite being less fit) and Stark (despite being tinier) still appeal more. If a decision was being made solely on facial features, then yes, Draange, Cap's wholesomeness would win. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/icon-arcee.gif)

[Sprocket]

I think a more pressing and complex issue is 'Why are there fangirls of Red Hood and the Outlaws'?

[MonsterFromMars]

Heroes less face it have victim complexes and low self esteem a lot more of the time that's why they do good in the first place

Sounds like Loki in Thor, the character the women in the OP would have been familiar with before going in to see the Avengers. Doesn't add up...
It's a different kind of Victim complex.

Spidey is always guilty because of his uncle thats associated with whinyness and depression. Superman wants to desperately fit in with humanity. Which can be associated with wanting approval and that can be based on low self esteem, and insecurity. To be fair superman hides it well. But it may turn women off to him if they see it at the root of his heroism instead of conviction.


With Loki, it's a different kind of victim complex. Odin is the allfather and Loki is rebelling to build his own kingship. It can be looked at as an ambitious son rivaling against his fathers overprotectiveness to achieve independence.

Im not saying thats the true face of it. Because it's really hate and jealousy, and some form of sociopathy.


But, it's easy to see Loki as an ambitious man that dosen't want to be ruled by other men. In that case Thor looks more like a bullying older brother keeping Loki down under daddies rule. The thing is Loki shows, independence, charisma, charm, and competence to do things on his own. Women like that because it shows conviction, and it shows he can provide without having to blunder and can provide on his own. I mean, he shows that he's capable of being independent which proves that in times of harsh conditions. He'd take initiative to provide and to maintain a kingdom.

If he were a passive prince under odins rule. It would be hard for him to prove that he wasn't made by Odin. Which would make Loki look weak. Also despite Loki being sociopathic. I think it's easy to see that he chafes under Odin and Thor because his potential is held back.

This post has been edited by MonsterFromMars: May 9 2012, 01:09 PM

[MonsterFromMars]

As for the baroness she does have some obnoxious traits. She can be bratty, Snotty, Pretentious, and kind of really combative.


But on the other hand she has a Hen Mother thing to her in terms of that she's more mature than Cobra Commander is (at least in the cartoons and not as crazy as he is in the comics). So she manages to run Cobra very competently and a lot of her abusive meanness is easy to see as overcompensation for being in a male dominated position, as well as tough love, and a strict no nonsense attitude.

The leather helps.

I don't know when I was younger I found the episodes that portrayed her humanity and vulnerability as likeable traits about her. I found the more machiavellian baroness in the comics dislikeable for her vain arrogance.

But, on the other hand she's very likeable because in both fictions she does have a method to her madness. Like Dissever says she's competent, and she has better morals than Cobra Commander does. Although not as good as Destro's. Her cutthroat behaviour makes her a no nonsense villain that will put the stupidity of other members of the organization in place. And keeps things organized.

So yup theres a lot of reasons for the Baronesses likeability beyond the black leather. And her love for Destro shows that she has some humanity. And her usually coming to Despise Cobra commanders childish self absorbtion shows she has a moral sensibility. She seems like she dosen't due to her entitlement but she actually cares about the health of the organization.

[Adam G]

I don't see this as a gender issue. Consider the classic male-centric love triangle. It's always the nice girl and the bad girl and while the nice girl usually winds up being the 'twue wuv', the bad girl is the one that's hot. I don't see how this would be any different for the ladytypes.

The opposite is true with men in fiction. The women start off wanting the good guy, but end up with the bad boy.

[NICKSAUR]

In most healthy stories, the bad boy also has a heart of gold. The contradiction is what's awesome and what elevates him above your typical jive head.

[MonsterFromMars]

Yup most of the bad boys girls love are guys that were pushed into particular circumstances that forced them to be that way.

I mean Cobra commander would be seen as a nutcase. While Destro is the morally ambiguous but honorable male. Who basically fights to make even in a cutthroat world.

At least in the marvel stuff.

[NICKSAUR]

Loki is not one of those guys.